New poster, labs in, need assistance

[leed]

Hello - I've been a lurker on here for some time, also over at the STTM site.
Ive been suffering for 5 years since my first AAS cycle, not coming to terms with the changes caused by abusing steroids.

Over the last 5 years I have done a handful of steroid cycles, finishing 1.5 years ago - since which time ive been clean.

I have attempted many PCT recovery cycles, including HCG, Clomid and Nolvadex.

I have tried every ancillary product , AIFM, Myogenex, Dermacrine, Carao extract, L-Carnatine, and possibly others that don't spring to mind now.

Ive suffered with the following symptoms for the last 5 years, in varying degrees.:

No libido
ED
Shrunken genitals
Low grade depression
Anxiety
Inability to feel love, emotions, happiness, excitement
Low concentration
Brain fog
Constipation
Bloating (stomach, face)
Muscle weakness
Fatigue
Estrogen fat depositary (face, stomach)
Low body temperature

I have just received back a full blood panel, which I believe points out the issues.
The tests were run by NPtech (UK)

a) Low LH
b) High Estrogen
c) Low Testosterone

Oddly, my body temperature has been low, as Ive been testing over the last 2 months (4 x per day), which indicated a adrenal / Thyroid issue.

Since these tests were taken, I began supplementing Isocort, and gradually over the last 2 weeks my temps have risen close to optimum.

I have been taking steroidal asthma inhalers for the last 15+ years which in some way I assume has effected my own cortisol production?

Please could I have the support of those with an opinion on this board, as I will take these figures to my own GP, but have had 1.5 years with little help from them so far - hence me taking the matter into my own hands

FYI - Im 27 years old, male

Thyroid profile

Free T3 5.6 [3.0 - 6.2 pmo/L]
Free T4 15.0 [12.0 - 22.0 pmo/L]
TSH 1.7 [0.4 - 4.0 mlU/L]
TgAb <10 [Less than 60 IU/ml]
TPO 9.1 [Less than 40 IU/ml]

Sex Hormone 1

Serum LH 3.1 [3 - 8 IU/L]
Serum FSH 3.9 [<8 IU/L]
Serum SHBG 18 [15 - 55 nmol/L]

Sex hormone 2

Serum Oestradiol 100.9 [28 - 156 pmol/L]
Serum progesterone 1.9 [0.7 - 4.3 nmol/L]
Serum testosterone 10.7 [9.9 - 27.8]

Extra

Vitamin B12 816* [128 - 648 pmo/L]
Serum Ferratin 249.3 [30 - 400 ng/ml]
Prolactin 167 [23 - 340 mIU/L]

Your thoughts are appreciated,

Thanks

Lee

[leed]

Hi - apologies for dragging this up and bumping!

What would be your suggestions based on the bloodwork?

Why would my LH be this low? is this linked to the use of AAS that promotes piturity tumors? (deca durabolin), or is it that my system thinks that due to the high Eastrogen dominance not to produce testosterone - hence the atrophied tight sensation I have in my testicals?

I have tried 3 restart protocols all which consisted of HCG, Nolvadex and Clomid - starting high then shortly dropping the HCG to taper over many weeks the Nolva and Clomid.

Is there a relationship between my lengthy corticosteroids use for asthma - and as Ive tried treating the sex hormone angle many times with no success that I have the cortisol / thyroid angle to also combat?

Would appreciate any advice to begin my search for freedom from this body I messed up

Lee

[pmgamer18]

Hi Lee I am not and never did a AAS cycle so can't help you much there. I do know you should not give up trying to restart your HPTA. Read this link.
day one of attempting to restart

Originally Posted by leed

Hello - I've been a lurker on here for some time, also over at the STTM site.
Ive been suffering for 5 years since my first AAS cycle, not coming to terms with the changes caused by abusing steroids.

Over the last 5 years I have done a handful of steroid cycles, finishing 1.5 years ago - since which time ive been clean.

I have attempted many PCT recovery cycles, including HCG, Clomid and Nolvadex.

I have tried every ancillary product , AIFM, Myogenex, Dermacrine, Carao extract, L-Carnatine, and possibly others that don't spring to mind now.

Ive suffered with the following symptoms for the last 5 years, in varying degrees.:



I have just received back a full blood panel, which I believe points out the issues.
The tests were run by NPtech (UK)

a) Low LH
b) High Estrogen
c) Low Testosterone

Oddly, my body temperature has been low, as Ive been testing over the last 2 months (4 x per day), which indicated a adrenal / Thyroid issue.

Your Thyroid is not bad your T3 is above the mid range but that does not mean a whole lot it's how you feel that tells the story. Try taking your temp first thing in the morning before you get up try not to move a lot put the gauge under your arm for 10 min.'s if you temp is under 97.8 on avg of doing this 3 mornings then you can have a thyroid problem. As to adrenals your temp does not tell the story here it's the movement or going up and down on an avg. of taking it 3 times a day. I your avg. goes up or down more then 2ths. this can mean your adrenals are stressed.

You sould not have started on Isocort without testing your cortisol levels in a Saliva test one that does it 4 x's in a day. Here are some labs from STTM site.
United Kingdom Labwork from NP Tech, where they will send out the kit for an ASI (adrenal stress test), plus sex hormones and a full thyroid panel etc. (thanks to “Mo” for this info)
Untitled Document

5) United Kingdom Labwork from Red Apple Clinic. Thyroid, Adrenals, and others. (thanks to Crunchie for this info).
Welcome Red Apple

If you cortisol levels are low then you need to do a ACTH Stim. test. But to do these tests you need to come off Idocort and be off it 2 weeks. So you need to come off it slow then be off 2 weeks. The ACTH test will tell you if you have a pituitary problem read this link.
Real Thyroid Help Forums :: View topic - My explaination of the ACTH stimulation test

Your Estradiol is not bad in my units it is 27 and we try to keep it at 10 to 30 best at 20 because your SHBG is on the lower side you can bring this 27 as low as 15 and you might feel better.

Your testosterone is low see if you can get on Testogel it is the same as Androgel here in the states. This will help make you feel better. But don't do this if your going to try a diff. PCT.

Originally Posted by leed

Since these tests were taken, I began supplementing Isocort, and gradually over the last 2 weeks my temps have risen close to optimum.

I have been taking steroidal asthma inhalers for the last 15+ years which in some way I assume has effected my own cortisol production?

Please could I have the support of those with an opinion on this board, as I will take these figures to my own GP, but have had 1.5 years with little help from them so far - hence me taking the matter into my own hands




Your thoughts are appreciated,

Thanks

Lee

There is a lot if info about steroidal asthma inhalers most of what I find is that asthma is caused by low cortisol levels read these links.
ADRENAL FATIGUE
Adrenal Glands
I hope this helps you being in the UK it is going to be hard getting this treated.

[leed]

Thanks for your advice Phil,

As for starting Isocort without testing, I was informed via various sources including the NP tech clinic that my asthma sprays would interfere with the test - so have started Isocort to ascertain if my temps would rise - to which they have.

No increase in Libido with just this however. erections are useless, no sensitivity etc etc

Ok - as you mentioned my blood T3 is within mid range, however my temps are low, and am attributing many symptoms to thyroid issues. Should I attempt to start on Armour, and see how I progress from there? - Is it worth a trial, going by symptoms?

I have tried many times to recover my HPTA, using the same protocols as day one of attempting to restart

Absolutely to no avail. My testcicals do loosen up and get larger, but no great increase in sexual libido.

From your point of view, is my LH within good range, I thought that this was low - hence the lack of testosterone being produced. I was planning on using testosterone only as a last resort - to be fair over-using it got me in this state I'm in now and I am reluctant to re-use it.;

Have read many times the quote 1) sort the adrenals 2) Sort the Thyroid 3) If sex hormones don't come back - restart HPTA PCT (or supplement with test), which is the road I was hoping to go down?

[pmgamer18]

Yes I feel your on the right track and you can try Armour as long as your adrenals are supported on the Isocort you can tell you taking your temps and charting them. Read this site.
Temperature Patterns of low adrenal and thyroid function
If your temps are not going up and down the avg. temp that is more then 2ths then start on Armour doing 30mgs 2x's a day when you start on this your temps will go up a little then in 2 weeks it will come dowm some this is when you add in 15mgs more of Armour. You can do this every 2 weeks upto 2.5 grains of armour then you need to hold on this for 6 weeks before going higher. The avg. dose of Armour is between 2 to 4 grains. Just go up slow.
The new fourm for STTM is.
Real Thyroid Help Forums :: Index

[leed]

Thanks Phil,

I'm about 6 weeks into armour, now on 1.75 grains per day.

Have got Rt3 tested, and was hoping someone could adivse if the following result falls within normal ranges?

17.8 ng/dl [9.0 - 35.0]

I understand that if the rt3 is to high I should stop Armour immediatly.

[leed]

Tyring to find out the answer for myself, this article (been posted before) is really descriptive - but units are in US, and need help in converting.

To overcome this diagnostic problem there is a special test that specifically measures reverse T3 alone and should be requested to rule out reverse T3 dominance. Ideally reverse T3 should be between 200-300 pmol/L and if found to be above 400 pmol/L indicates the presence of reverse T3 dominance. If reverse T3 dominance is diagnosed it may be treated by supplementing T3 once adrenal exhaustion, hypoglycemia and/or low sex hormone levels have been ruled out and/or treated.

Looked around the internet for rT3 ng/ml to pmol/L conversions with no luck!

Anyone?

[JanSz]

Originally Posted by leed

Tyring to find out the answer for myself, this article (been posted before) is really descriptive - but units are in US, and need help in converting.



Looked around the internet for rT3 ng/ml to pmol/L conversions with no luck!

Anyone?

Stop The Thyroid Madness :: View topic - Another Reverse T3 Question


NGC - NGC Summary

TT4 = 28 (2.2) nmol/L (micrograms/dL)

FT4 = 6 (0.5) pmol/L (ng/dL)

TT3 = 0.55 (35) nmol/L (ng/dL)

FT3 = 1.5 (0.1) pmol/L (ng/dL)

TSH = 0.75 mIU/L

Tg = 1.5 micrograms/L (ng/mL)


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
How about closing your eyes and ears.
Just keep taking Armour thyroid and do frequent testing of FreeT3 and freeT4 only, forget all other thyroid indicators.
Take enough Armour Thyroid so your FreeT3 is at the top range, and FreeT4 very close to the top,
sometimes to do that one have to add some Levothyroxine (T4).
Take a breather when you are around 4-5 grains.

[leed]

Thanks for coming to my conversion rescue again Janz - thankyou for your patience.

Im stuck however with the following:

To convert T3from nmol/L to ng/cL (total)
or pmol/L to pg/dL (free), multiply by 65.1

My values are in ng/ml - which im sure you already noticed, so question is how do I get 17.8 ng/ml into pmol/L

Thanks again, will trawl STTM tommorow if you arent free to answer this tonight - cheers, Lee

[JanSz]

Originally Posted by leed

Tyring to find out the answer for myself, this article (been posted before) is really descriptive - but units are in US, and need help in converting.

Quote:
To overcome this diagnostic problem there is a special test that specifically measures reverse T3 alone and should be requested to rule out reverse T3 dominance. Ideally reverse T3 should be between 200-300 pmol/L and if found to be above 400 pmol/L indicates the presence of reverse T3 dominance. If reverse T3 dominance is diagnosed it may be treated by supplementing T3 once adrenal exhaustion, hypoglycemia and/or low sex hormone levels have been ruled out and/or treated.


Looked around the internet for rT3 ng/ml to pmol/L conversions with no luck!

Anyone?

You have posted:
Free T3 5.6 [3.0 - 6.2 pmo/L]

then you started on Armour and you say:
I'm about 6 weeks into armour, now on 1.75 grains per day.

(5.6-3.0)/6.2-3.0)=0.8125
you started 81% full on your FreeT3, were missing 19% than added 1.75grains.

You should retest your FreeT3, if your FreeT3 ~6.2

possibly you thyroid is as good as it will ever be.

[pmgamer18]

Your RT3 is fine mine is 24 higher then yours as long as your in range your ok.

[JanSz]

Originally Posted by pmgamer18

Your RT3 is fine mine is 24 higher then yours as long as your in range your ok.

Phil;
what do you think.
I have couple machines in my garage, another words they are 40 feet away from where I am.
When I plan to go for 5-7 minute exercise

I take temperature 36.7C~98.1F
seven minutes latter 35.7C~96.3F
about 15 minute latter my temp is back to where it was.

any conclussions that can be drawn from this?

[pmgamer18]

I have found the same thing I think when we are up and doing thngs are temps go down. This is why the stie says to sit for about 15 min.'s before taking temps and charthing them.