Reverse T negative feedback

[Jtay]

Also in regards to the dose of baclofen I plan to start out with...

It will be either 2.5 mg 3X daily (7.5 mg/d ) or 5 mg 3x daily (15 mg/d) to be monitored with appropriate tests every 30 days and dose to be increased or decreased accordingly until I reach my optimum LH level.

I will buy the 10mg tablets and 1/4 or 1/2 them depending on my decision, I will let you know.

[HeadDoc]

Originally Posted by Naturdoc

If I'm not mistaken, Phenibut is an over the counter supplement that works simiarly to Baclofen.

I've used Phenibut sparingly for tension or sleep. There seems to be controversy over tolerance. I'm not trying to hijack the thread. Just trying to clarify. I have never found anything about phenibut related to HRT.

[Jtay]

Hello Head Doc,

It's not possible to hijack the thread. I'm just a visitor here and appreciate all input . It is important to know both sides of the story from one's personal experience. thanks

[Jtay]

Also, I just happen to have low LH levels thus will begin baclofen first and then TRT if I need it. However, if you are one of those with high LH levels then baclofen may still benefit you with a reverse protocol. You may want to begin TRT first which will drive your LH level into the ground. Once your about 1/2 way to your optimum T goal then you may desire to begin baclofen to get your LH back up to speed which should also further increase T. Once your LH is up to speed, adjust yout TRT up or down accordingly. HRT is a balancing act. It may take a few attempts to get it right.

[HeadDoc]

Originally Posted by Jtay

Hello Head Doc,

It's not possible to hijack the thread. I'm just a visitor here and appreciate all input . It is important to know both sides of the story from one's personal experience. thanks

it's good to have you here. You bring something new. Once the initial exchanges finish, I hope that you will stay and give us feedback on your proposed trials in this thread.

[Jtay]

More evidence that Baclofen may be "The Magic Pill?

Imagine real growth hormone for just a dollar a day........ (3 pills daily x .30 +/- avg)

"We found that baclofen administration led to a significant increase in GH release both in manic patients and healthy controls"

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/en...ubmed_RVDocSum

"The results showed that baclofen administration led to a significant increase in GH"

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/en...ubmed_RVDocSum

"Following baclofen administration, plasma GH rose in healthy males"

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/en...ubmed_RVDocSum

[Jtay]

Now you know one more BIG reason why you might not have heard of the potential benefits of this old, boring, pill.

Imagine the lost revenues to big pharma and the docs if everyone knew they could elevate their own growth hormone for just a dollar a day?

The million dollar question is.... if this really works, and as more and more people find out about it, how long will it take for them to yank it from the market or spread false propaganda so that you won't have access to it to protect their billion dollar growth hormone business?

The other million dollar question is......why am I sharing my years of research with you that may jeopardize my own cure....Lol!

[eeso]

Is it safe to take it long term though?

I'm not sure if I'd want to experiment with an anti-spastic drug

[Jtay]

Hear ye, hear ye....

naturally occurring

LH
testosterone
Growth Hormone
IGF-I

on sale today while supplies last for just a dollar a day.......Lol

Bodybuilders imagine ,....

bulging muscles with a bulging speedo
and no more aggression

Anti-Aging buffs imagine ...
no more needles
no more fat


Oh, I'm getting tired and delusional...you have to forgive me. I'll be better once I take my pill...Lol!

[Jtay]

It's only a muscle relaxant used for anti-spastic related illness.
I post this link again regarding its safety:

"Our results demonstrated that, in our experimental model, neither concentration affected previous neuronal survival. Considering the above results, we can conclude that at the used concentrations, this drug is safe and its clinical use should be encouraged."

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...21a85a321 8b4

[Jtay]

Sorry here the link again. It is also on the 1st page of my posts. You and others would do well to read all posts and links on this thread if you truly want to learn about this drug: Also, I will post my test results maybe bi-weekly

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...cc21a85a3218b4

[Jtay]

Also, this link is worth a repost:

"In conclusion, low-dose baclofen administration for 4 weeks stimulated the growth hormone-IGF-I axis in persons with SCI, with the potential for beneficial effects on body composition."

Drum Roll......the last nine words again please written by scientist, not me:

"WITH THE POTENTIAL FOR BENEFICIAL EFFECTS ON BODY COMPOSITION"

http://jcp.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/46/4/476

[eeso]

Ok well i'll be very interested to see your blood tests.

my total test level is just at the bottom of range so i could potentially benefit from this drug

[Matt Muscle]

Well, Baclofen sounds similar in some respects to GHB, in regard to it also being a GABA agonist and that it has Growth Hormone releasing properties. Interesting.

[zkt]

Neurontin, or gabapentin is another drug that effects the GABA mechanism.
"Gabapentin is structurally related to the neurotransmitter GABA (gamma-aminobutyric acid) but it does not modify GABAA or GABAB radioligand binding, it is not converted metabolically into GABA or a GABA agonist, and it is not an inhibitor of GABA uptake or degradation."
Apparently the mode of action is, in effect, to increaase the amount of GABA in the brain as contrasted to Baclofen which is a GABAb agonist.
http://www.rxlist.com/cgi/generic/gabapent_cp.htm
Whether it also has effects on LH and FSH, as baclofen does, remains to be seen.

[zkt]

The reason for exploring the effects of Gabapentin on LH was to gain insite into the mechanism of Bclofens action. Most of the research involving Gabapentin concerns epylipsy and menopausal hot flashes. LH seems to be involved in the proceses abut I didnt find any direct evidence that Gabapentin increases LH.

[zkt]

Originally Posted by Jtay

ZKT,

I just read about your circumstance. How have you been testing your cortisol? Have you ever done a diurnal cortisol saliva test? It would be interesting knowing the results. Also, would like to know your cholesterol test results and pregnenelone if you have it. Cholesterol is the first step in bio-sythesis of steroid hormones. High cholesterol, low preg may tell us something about your P450.

Ever read the book our stolen future? A good read and the authors make a valid case as to why Andropuase is at record levels and rapidly progressing. Also, take a fasting insulin test if you haven't already. This will indicate whether or not your insulin resistant .

Also, I'm sure you have a blood glucose monitor. Take your levels when you wake, when you go to sleep, before you eat, and 30 minutes and 1-hour after you eat and let me know.

I am not giving medical advice here as I am not a doctor. However, I may have some interesting observations.

Yes Preg, Progest, DHEA and a four point cortisol test on my list and are waiting for approval from the VA. My glucose has always been normal but thats a good idea to check the fasting level. Thanks, will add it. LDL total cholesterol(C) and HDL are tested frequently will have latest results soon. I`ll keep you informed. Re. the C situation; currently on Crestor and Zetia and Gemfiprozil 600mg/D for triglycerides. I am launching an all out attack of the LDL-HDL ratio by increasing the Gem to 600Mg/2XD and starting niacin 400mg/D at bedtime and titrating up to 1g/D.Studies haave found that this regimine can increase HDL by almost 50%.
Betrter living thru modern chemistry !

[Jtay]

Originally Posted by Matt Muscle

Well, Baclofen sounds similar in some respects to GHB, in regard to it also being a GABA agonist and that it has Growth Hormone releasing properties. Interesting.

"GHB and related compounds continue to be abused, although the effects of these compounds are different from previously characterized drugs of abuse. A rapidly growing literature, including data obtained in this newly developed drug discrimination procedure with baclofen, strongly implicates GABAB mechanisms in the behavioral actions of GHB. That baclofen is not abused (like GHB) could be due to differential effects of these compounds at GABAB receptor subtypes, to different mechanisms (direct versus modulation) of action at the same GABAB receptors, to actions on non-GABAergic systems, or to nonpharmacologic factors (availability) that can dramatically influence recreational drug use."

Here is the full scoop comparing GHB with Baclofen. For those that don't want to be bored with the science just go direct to the "Discussion".

http://jpet.aspetjournals.org/cgi/co...full/309/2/540

[Jtay]

This is important to note now that the discussion of Baclofen and GHB is taking place:

FOR THOSE THINKING THAT BACLOFEN CAN BE SUBSTITUTED FOR GHB FOR THE PURPOSE OF RECREATIONAL DRUG USE/ABUSE, THINK AGAIN.

Another reason why Baclofen may indeed be the "Magic Pill". It provides all the benefits of GHB without the addictive traits which means you wont get the same addictive stimulation/euphoria as with GHB although you will get the same heath benefits and even better. I have another study of which I have to locate that shows Baclofen as 60% more effective that GHB in this regard if my memory serves me correct.

It is important to note that GHB has much history of helping people and is still used in medicine in this regard. It was not until GHB became a recreational drug of choice that it gained a darkened reputation.

[Jtay]

In fact, some doctors prescribe baclofen to help wean those addicted off of GHB.

[Jtay]

Also, regarding dosage......

Remember, the more you spread it out the better effect you will have and the less likely you will get the undesirable sedative/sleepy effect unless you desire to use it as a sleep aid that is.

"Peak plasma concentrations of baclofen are achieved within 2 hours and the plasma half-life is 2 to 4 hours. "

"The half-life of a quantity, subject to exponential decay, is the time required for the quantity to decay to half of its initial value."

In consideration of the above, you can clearly see with the half-life occurring in 2-4 hours why taking the drug every 4-8 hours is ideal. Obviously, you can't take it every 4 hours or else you would have to wake up at night . Therefore, taking it every 6 or 8 hours is ideal. The directions recommend every 8 hours (3x daily) which is what I will adhere to as I desire 8 hours of sleep although I seldom get it.

In furtherance of my prior post regarding the dosage I plan to start out with.....

I will buy the 10mg tablets and half them (they are scored). I will start with 5mg every eight hours (3x daily) for a total of 15mg/d.

Also, a big pharma in China also makes this drug. Considering the controversy with China meds , I would be sure to check with your pharmacy to ensure the manufacturer is a reputable manufacturer.

If you are buying the Generic brand in lieu of the brand name, Lioresal, go to this link and it will give you all the manufacturers and photos of each pill so you can confirm you are getting the real deal.

http://www.drugdigest.org/DD/DVH/ListImages/1,20242,64|1,00.html

Another brand name is Kemstro however, I'm leery of this brand because their literature indicates it doesn't cross the blood brain barrier (BBB) when in fact, all the science says baclofen freely crosses the BBB and Lioresal confirms this as well. This conflict is strange and can probably be cleared up with a phone call to, Ke