Table of T Levels By 10-Year Age Group (Appendix from David Z's TRT Primer)

[DavidZ]

Attached is an Excel file with the tables of Total and Free T levels from the Appendix of my TRT Primer.

This table is awesome. It shows average Total and Free T levels by 10-year age group from 2 different studies that correlate extremely well. Included in the tables are mean and standard deviation values as well as 5th, 10th and 95th percentile values.

[BigPooka]

Man seeing that table, how its all broken down is very nice. Just makes me want to kick my old doctors ass for saying I was ok w/ a level of 287. Thank God for Doc who know what they are doing. Especially you Swale.

Pooka

[DavidZ]

Originally Posted by BigPooka

Man seeing that table, how its all broken down is very nice. Just makes me want to kick my old doctors ass for saying I was ok w/ a level of 287.

Yes, this table tells quite a story, doesn't it?

Originally Posted by BigPooka

Thank God for Doc who know what they are doing.

They're a treasure.

Originally Posted by BigPooka

Especially you Swale. Pooka

Especially Swale for making himself available in a forum like this and putting up with contentious buggers like me.

[earthdog]

This needs to be a sticky BIG TIME! Thanks David!!!

[SWALE]

Contencious guys keep us thinking.

We'll sticky this once it runs a bit. Thanks, DavidZ.

[ANTB]

Do you need excel to be able to view this?

[pmgamer18]

Yes
Phil

[mxim]

i am a bit skeptical due to the fact that the amount of patients in each group was small. realistically,most men from 38-42 have T levels in the 400's.

[bullmastiff]

I was shocked to see how high the numbers were...Hard to believe that
men in their 50's were still around 550...I would like to see a very broad test
done that sampled men of different backgrounds.

[DavidZ]

Originally Posted by mxim

i am a bit skeptical due to the fact that the amount of patients in each group was small.

The tables represent two different studies. Since the results are similar, these studies effectively validate each other.

Also, the number of men in the second study was more than large enough to be considered statistically significant. There were about 150 to 300 men in each 5- or 10-year age band. That's well above the generally accepted minimum of 30 for statistical significance.

Originally Posted by mxim

realistically,most men from 38-42 have T levels in the 400's.

I suspect that you're going by your observations of men that frequent this type of group. That group consists entirely of men who are, or think they may be, hypogonadal. That's definitely a statistically biased sample.

[DavidZ]

Originally Posted by bullmastiff

I was shocked to see how high the numbers were...Hard to believe that
men in their 50's were still around 550...I would like to see a very broad test
done that sampled men of different backgrounds.

See my response above one post above and my new thread on Quest Diagnostics' new age-based normal ranges. Quest's new Total T normal range for men age 50-59 is 119-1104.

[HeadDoc]

thanks for looking for these Bullwinkle

[love_en]

I saw this table posted at the Yahoo Hypogonadism group before my fall-out with the endo. You've got to be joking if you think 388ng/dl is healthy. I am only 33. I should be close to 600 if I am reading the tables correctly. Someone is asking for a paper suppository, as well as a year-long cycle of cyproterone and finasteride. Why do labs not use these numbers as reference ranges?

[Prospero]

The problem with this kind of table is that it doesn't list the reference range for the measurements.. When I'm looking at reference ranges (from the laboratory manuals of two local labs) for free testosterone, one lab lists 100-500 pmol/l (method LIA, age group 16-50 years old men) while the other lab lists 60-140 pmol/l (method RIA, age group 15-39 years old men). So, the result from first lab could be 300 pmol/l and from the other 100 pmol/l, and both would be at 50% of reference range of that particular lab, and these both results from the same sample!

Would this not mean that just a reading of "free testosterone" without a reference range of that particular lab is not useful at all, at least, for comparing to actual results of one's own blood samples from commercial lab?

[pmgamer18]

Not sure what your looking for but I have this link that has levels by age.
http://www.natural-hrt.com/andropause04.html

[love_en]

Originally Posted by Prospero

The problem with this kind of table is that it doesn't list the reference range for the measurements.. When I'm looking at reference ranges (from the laboratory manuals of two local labs) for free testosterone, one lab lists 100-500 pmol/l (method LIA, age group 16-50 years old men) while the other lab lists 60-140 pmol/l (method RIA, age group 15-39 years old men). So, the result from first lab could be 300 pmol/l and from the other 100 pmol/l, and both would be at 50% of reference range of that particular lab, and these both results from the same sample!

Would this not mean that just a reading of "free testosterone" without a reference range of that particular lab is not useful at all, at least, for comparing to actual results of one's own blood samples from commercial lab?

The reference range bullshit is why I am not able to be treated properly by a doctor. Unless someone has been irreversably brainwashed by the impotent morons who call themselves endocrinologists, it can be agreed that a total T under 450 is questionable when that level is combined with longstanding complaints about body composition and/or sexual function.

A good analogy to reference ranges for T and cortisol is grades. If many people have scored low at that particular lab, it lowers the curve. In this case, lowering the curve is not good for you, because you must now score below that lowest score before the average doctor will even think of treating you. Here in Hawaii, DLS Diagnostics sets minimum total T at 190 for an adult male. I have a morbid curiousity as to what that man looks like.

That table is obtained by surveying healthy men. By healthy I am assuming men with normal sexual function and body composition. By contrast, the only times I can think of when a doctor will order a T level is drawn is in the context of ED. muscle wasting, osteoporosis and that is often when the well-educated patient brings it up. Otherwise, a man's problems are blamed on psychiatric issues or a circulatory fault, time for the blue pill and green capsule. So those reference ranges are not representative of what is healthy.

I will conceed the point that it is not healthy to dose T in such a way to drive levels above the top of the reference range. That is the only circumstance when a reference range should be taken seriously. Having said that, I would love to be the guy who tested at 1037 here in Hawaii. If same person did not need DepoT, Pregnyl or Clomid to achieve such high levels.

[MrT]

Originally Posted by mxim

i am a bit skeptical due to the fact that the amount of patients in each group was small. realistically,most men from 38-42 have T levels in the 400's.

I have never heard that. Can you cite your source?

[pmgamer18]

Originally Posted by MrT

I have never heard that. Can you cite your source?

I your wondering what you levels should be on TRT you need to try to get your Total and Free T levels up in to the upper 1/3 of your labs range for a young man. And to keep your Estradiol "E2" down between 10 to 30 best at 20.

[SteveJohn1965]

I am new member and I am dealing with Low Free Testosterone.

One puzzling item I found on the table, the percentage of free T is our body is about 0.3 to 0.48%.From this table it is more like 2%. Something does not add up here. Is this truely free Testosterone, or just loosely bounded testosterone?

-Steve

[s0b]

This free testosterone leves look strange. Whats the ranges? I have free testo of 15.5 and im considered very low. Something is wrong either with the units or something else. Plus how can someone raise his SHBG?

[s0b]

This free testosterone levels look strange. Whats the ranges? I have free testo of 15.5 and im considered very low. Something is wrong either with the units or something else. Plus how can someone raise his SHBG?