can trt ever help sperm production, and will DIM effect it

[masterpp]

so guys after about 6 months of infertility due too much testogel, i have some motile sperm once again.

i obviously dont want to screw this up, but someone once said that a little supplementation of ones own T levels, with say a half normal dosage or testogel, amy help spermatogenesis, as it requires high ish levels of T.

so should i supplement with a half dose, or will this effect my hpta too much and ill lose the sperm again.

also will DIm/indolplex effect spermatogenesis

[masterpp]

bump

[marianco]

FROM ANONYMOUS: im 19 and have very low testosterone, sky high lh and fsh, caused by varicocele which degenerated my testicles.

i went on trt for 6 months which desimated my sperm count. ive know been off trt for several months and im going to start banking sperm as its gradually started to return (i had a recent analysis)

my question is whether it is a bad idea to take DIM/indolplex if im trying to bank. i have an incredibly low fertility and dont want to effect my chances. also would doing half a pack of testogel (2.5g) effect my HPTA to such an extent that it would effect fertility, (i dont have HCG)

as ive mentioned fertility is the key, but id quite like to improve my body a little if i can as well, and once ive banked i can hit the testogel hard.

Testosterone replacement therapy increases testosterone levels. This is sensed by the hypothalamus, which then reduces the release of Follicle Stimulating Hormone (FSH) and Luteinizing Hormone (LH) from the Pituitary. Luteinizing Hormone is needed to increase testosterone production from the testes. Follicle Stimulating Hormone is needed to stimulate sperm production.

When a person has low testosterone and sperm production because of testicular hypofunction, the FSH and LH levels are very high because the brain is trying its hardest to stimulate testosterone production (which also increases sperm production). Testosterone replacement will reduce FSH and LH, causing a reduction in testosterone and sperm production.

There is more to the story...

Sperm production is also dependent on having adequate Estrogen Activity and Oxytocin Activity. Both are linked. Estrogen increases Oxytocin release. Estrogen stimulates sperm production and testicular size - just as FSH/LH and its analog HCG do. Oxytocin, itself, can increase sperm production and ejaculate volume. Ejaculate fluid itself is necessary for normal fertility - the sperm alone would be useless in normal sex.

High estrogen levels can reduce sex drive and can have other adverse effects - such as heart attacks, strokes, and blood clots.

Low estrogen levels also can reduce sex drive and can have other adverse effects - such as high cholesterol levels, impaired memory - and low sperm production.

The use of DIM and I3C to reduce estrogen activity may seriously reduce sperm production just as reducing FSH and LH levels (from increasing testosterone levels) can do. If anything, it is important to maintain physiologic estrogen levels to maintain sperm production.

If a person has low testosterone levels, which can lead to low estrogen levels, it may be important to increase estrogen to normal physiologic levels to stimulate sperm production.

It is important to balance estrogen with normal progesterone levels - which helps protect the person from some of the risks of estrogen (blood clots, heart attacks, stroke).

Oxytocin may be considered to raise sperm production and ejaculate volume. However it is a non-usual and a nonstandard treatment even by TRT standards. It can be compounded into a nasal spray - the dose range is about 10-24 IU a day. It is highly important for this to be monitored by a physician. Oxytocin, at its worse, can raise blood pressure, can result in excessive fluid retention, and other potentially fatal risks (just as estrogen can lead to heart attack, stroke and blood clots). These can be monitored on exam and lab testing.

[cpeil2]

Originally Posted by marianco

...

High estrogen levels can reduce sex drive and can have other adverse effects - such as heart attacks, strokes, and blood clots.

Is it known with any specificity which of the estrogen metabolites leads to the blood clots?

[masterpp]

amazing response.
so what your saying is that it may harm fertility to take dim, and that the increase in my testosterone levels by doing half a pack of testogel (hopefully which wont fully shut down fsh and lh) will still have an adverse effect as the decrease in lh and fsh will outway any positive benefits trt will have on fertlitity.

basically are u saying that trt (as opposed to hcg therapy for seconday guys) can never have a positive effect on fertility

[marianco]

Originally Posted by masterpp

amazing response.
so what your saying is that it may harm fertility to take dim, and that the increase in my testosterone levels by doing half a pack of testogel (hopefully which wont fully shut down fsh and lh) will still have an adverse effect as the decrease in lh and fsh will outway any positive benefits trt will have on fertlitity.

basically are u saying that trt (as opposed to hcg therapy for seconday guys) can never have a positive effect on fertility

An individual's response may vary. I would not say never. Never say never as the saying goes.

Factors which increase sperm production include:
1. Follicle Stimulating Hormone (FSH)
2. Estrogen
3. Oxytocin

Increasing testosterone by directly giving it through injections and transdermal gels may reduce FSH enough that sperm production may be significantly slowed or halted. Increasing testosterone may, however, lead to increased estrogen and oxytocin, which then may lead to sperm production. Increasing testosterone excessively may completely stop FSH production, may lead to a halt in sperm production, independent of how much estrogen is available.

If a person is already having significant trouble making sperm because of injury or other factors, reducing estrogen activity by taking DIM may be a bad idea since it may compromise an already compromised sperm production. To determine this, a person can do labs.

It is - as always with TRT - important to measure parameters so the direction in treatment can be determined. A person's FSH, Estrogens, Oxytocin, and sperm production and quality can be all be measured - just as other factors in TRT (such as cholesterol level, blood pressure, blood sugar, etc.)

When considering taking a new substance or changing doses, it is important to take "before" and then later "after" labs to determine what was changed by the substance or change in treatment. This way, a person is not flying blind.

[masterpp]

i had know idea estrogen played such an important role in sperm production. ive been trying to lower it with zinc, and i was just about to buy DIM, so i guess i really should just wait and till ive got sperm banked.

as for taking a half pack of testogel, im still not decided, as although my lh and fsh are sky high, i dont want to compromise sperm activity in any way.

[pmgamer18]

Originally Posted by masterpp

i had know idea estrogen played such an important role in sperm production. ive been trying to lower it with zinc, and i was just about to buy DIM, so i guess i really should just wait and till ive got sperm banked.

as for taking a half pack of testogel, im still not decided, as although my lh and fsh are sky high, i dont want to compromise sperm activity in any way.

Have you had your sperm tested most men with low T and high LH and FSH are primary and this means there Testis are not working and there sperm can be bad.

[marianco]

Originally Posted by pmgamer18

Have you had your sperm tested most men with low T and high LH and FSH are primary and this means there Testis are not working and there sperm can be bad.

With Intracytoplasmic sperm injection (ICSI), pregnancy can still be achieved in some cases. I would consult with a reproductive endocrinologist about the issues with sperm.