Men's Health Forum: This is a discussion on Did some research on libido... within the Anabolic Steroids forums, part of the extensive steroid information at MESO-Rx; I found this quite interesting. Some of you may already know this but I figured just in case I wasn't ...
I found this quite interesting. Some of you may already know this but I figured just in case I wasn't the only one who didn't know I'd share it.
Anyway, for those of us who have a low (in some cases non-existant) libido there may be hope yet. There are four drugs produced by the brain that I'll be covering. We'll start with Dopamine.
Dopamine is the drug responsible for pleasure. During various activites Dopamine is released as a "reward"...this can include eating, dangerous activities, sex...basically anything that ultimately makes us feel good (of course the reason we feel good is the Dopamine). Go back a hundred or so years ago. We didn't have all of the sweets, refined foods, high-excitment activites, etc that we do now. What does that have to do with anything? I'll get to that in a minute.
Ok, another drug is Prolactin. We all know about prolactin and its role in TRT. What I did not know is that Prolactin is like a downer and its release is regulated by Dopamine.
The third drug is Seratonin. The fourth is Oxytocin. I'll get to both of those later. For now, let's discuss the previous ones.
As I said before, various activities release Dopamine. The body's natural response is to release Prolactin to "take the edge off". This is done to help curb our pleasure from it so we don't overindulge. Think about when most men have sex...once they have an orgasm they don't want any more...for at least a little while. Here's where the fun comes into play...and history. Look at it like a drug. When you first do heroin (or coke or whatever...even nicotine) a small amount feels great. After a while you build up a tolerance to it so you need more. Similar to Dopamine except that we don't build up a tolerance...the body simply is producing more Prolactin. With more prolactin you need an even larger dose of Dopamine to experience that same amount of pleasure as before. Make sense so far?
Now we need to look at our lifestyles. We eat a sugary treat--the brain likes it so it releases a reward, Dopamine--brain reacts and releases a small amount of Prolactin. That's all fine and dandy but we don't stop with a small treat. Every day we are getting all sorts of things to make us feel good, sugar, refined foods, sex, television and more. Even dangerous activites, such as these extreme sports today, cause a release of Dopamine. The brain, sensing all of this excess Dopamine, has only one course of action and that is to release large quantities of Prolactin...which in turn makes us seek more of whatever it was that caused us to feel good in the first place...and the cycle goes on and on.
Eventually, the problem can become so sever that the "high" we get from Dopamine only lasts for a short time and the "low" from the Prolactin lasts scores of time longer, many times being mistaken by physicians as depression.
Since I'm on the subject of depression, let's discuss Seratonin. One of the side effects of many anti-depression drugs is to cause a release of Seratonin. The problem there is that elevated levels of Seratonin causes Dopamine to be reduced, furthering the person's state of depression.
Finally, higher levels of Oxytocin seem to regulate many of the brain's hormones, including those mentioned above. It tends to keep things in check (to a certain degree) and also provides us with a certain amount of pleasure as well....most of that comes in the form of a loving feeling of attachment for your current partner. Studies have shown that injections of Oxytocin in various types of animals (not many human studies) has led to a reduction in the seeking of pleasure producing activities but an increase in the amount of pleasure experienced per activity. In other words, you get the excitment without having to go crazy looking for it.
This started out as a tanning drug (get the tan without the sun damage) but had great side effects, such as increased libido and even ED correction in some men. It sounds as if it may be the first drug with few bad sides which can actually help affect one's libido within the brain! This could be good news for many. Personally, I'm looking forward to seeing how it fares in the final phase of testing.
Yes... the most important sexual organ we have is indeed the Brain.
I have done alot of reading /searching on dopamine and prolactin and such drugs that interfere with both or one, ie apomorphine, cabergoline, selegilline etc in relation to libido.... as i felt there was much more to my libido problems than just testoterone... but the more you learn about all this stuff the more you realise we have a long way to go in regard to truely understanding it.
You would think that cabergoline, which is a dopamine agonist and lowers prolactin(in relation to what was said in the above article) would be the wonder drug for male sexuality!.....but is that the case?
The new impotence drug PT-141, sounds promising. Uprima (apomorphine HCL)is meant to to target dopamine receptors in the hypothalamus... has anyone had any experience with it?
One thing I forgot to mention, which has some bearing on your comments about cabergoline, is that due to our near constant exposure to the stimuli which cause a release of Dopamine, not only are we getting the extra Prolactin but the Dopamine receptors are getting down-regulated as well. There is a lot of research going on right now trying to figure out how to up-regulate those receptors...thus far with nearly zero success.
However, I did some checking into an ancient method apparently developed by Taoists. People in this era have used it successfully to rid themselves of certain habits (one is a woman who could only experience orgasm while thinking of torture...she had an obsession with pain due to some childhood trauma--again that "next level" requirement) and others who just didn't have a desire for sex possibly due to the lack of sensitivity in the brain to Dopamine. If anyone is interested I'll find the link and post it. Hell, I'll probably do just that anyway. Just give me some time to find it.
Last edited by Weatherlite; 11-14-2005 at 02:23 AM.
It looks like you're talking about Melanotan or Melanotan II. This drug is actually available right now, although it still has not been approved for use. There are entire websites out there full of people who have experimented with the drug. You can also get it right now, from the suppliers that frequent the boards. However, be very careful who you buy from. Read the posts and discover who provides the solutions that provide resutls. Keep in mind that these messageboards are very centered on the tanning capabilities of the drug, and not on the libido.
There are quite a few things that stop me from using it. Number one, it's an injectible. Number two, you have to mix it every time you inject, and keep all components refridgerated/frozen, even during shipment. Number three, it's very expensive.
The BIGGEST complaint I have about the drug is the mole/freckle darkening. It was developed (and is still being developed) as a tanning drug. The main problem is that it can make freckles worse. It makes moles worse, too. By worse, of course, I mean "darker/more visible." I have a few very small brown freckles on my face, and if I were to take this drug, they would turn into black dots! If you don't have moles, though. I can't see a reason why one wouldn't want to experiment with it.
The other problem is that long term use is very questionable. If you are using it to repair a libido, you could end up becoming darker and darker each month you use it!
I've had experience with Uprima. I've had experience with EVERYTHING. I bought two packets of four. Thus, I've tried it a total of eight times.
It did not work at all for me. It left a strange "orangy" taste in my mouth and left me as limp as I began. I have even tried it in combination with Viagra.
Like the literature for it reads, it leaves you with a headache. This drug will not be the "next big thing," trust me on that one. If anything it's one of those placebos with double blind studies to back up a minimal or completely percieved subjective benefit.
Wow, that was quick. I found em fairly fast. I also discovered that I was a bit misled by a few articles. Apparently Oxytocin is a female hormone! OOPS! From what I have seen so far the male counterpart is Vasopressin. I'm still researching that one but it looks like it may play the same role in men.
The second one tells almost the same as the first but has some other info in it.
Most of these below are all about sex and concentrating on how non-orgasmic sex (for a while) can lead to improved sex lives, increased happiness and more pleasure from life in general. I only post this cause this is where I found a lot of info...I'm not necessarily advocating their path although I do find it intriguing.
While we are on the topic of libido and possible supplements to support it -- has anyone tried Nasutra?
It's extremely expensive (approx. 10$ per dose.) It does not contain ANY herb that I have seen in any of the mass marketed libido supplements. They guarantee that it will work the first time and every time, or your money will be returned.
It's a combination of "specially extracted" Chineese herbs.
My Review:
(Take it from the young man (24) who'se had no libido for the last 12 years.)
THIS IS THE STRONGEST HERBAL SUPPLEMENT YOU CAN BUY. So much so, that I would swear that they are slipping Viagra or Cialis into this "herbal" medication. Why? Within 20 minues of ingesting the pills -- each and every time -- I start to get that Viagra "blue vision." It is not mild. It is very apparent and almost disturbing. When I move my eyes, I see trails of electric blue streaks from any lightsource in the room. As it dies down, I begin to see "ghost trails." Moving my hand infront of my face causes a ghost white outline of the hand to follow -- and takes a good few seconds to do so!
So, yes, this stuff actually does something. I don't know WHAT it is doing, but it's doing the same thing that Viagra does which causes Viagra's sides.
I couldn't tell you if it works, though. I did get erect, and everything worked out, but it was not a dazzling experience or anythign that the product literature would lead you to believe. I would not reccomend it as a libido supplement, just an erectile aid.
James, yes, that's what it started out as...Melanotan. This company picked it up and did the legwork to find out which part of it affected the brain, specifically the hypothalmus, so that they could minimze the tanning effect while still keeping the libido effect. So far it looks good. I imagine that if the Melanotan works for libido fairly well that this new version which has been optimized for libido should work even better.
Did some research on libido... 
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