Men's Health Forum: This is a discussion on Great response to certain DIM brand within the Anabolic Steroids forums, part of the extensive steroid information at MESO-Rx; Here's my protocol: 0.80 ml T- cyp once a week, 400 iu of HCG (Novarel) for the 4 days prior ...
Here's my protocol: 0.80 ml T-cyp once a week, 400 iu of HCG (Novarel) for the 4 days prior to T-cyp injection. Bloodwork drawn 2 days after T-cyp injection when total T should be peaking.
I have been on this for about 3 months now. My total T levels have been running around 670 which is right where Dr. Shippen wanted it., but my E2 was up to around 50 pg/mL. I started taking 30 mg zinc chelate once a day and 1 DIM by Nature's Way. E2 didnt budge. Tried 2 DIM a day. Still no change. Then switched to the one pill a day of the DIM brand Phil has suggested and what a difference it seems to have made. Just got my labs back and total T was 747 while E2 dropped to 35 pg/mL. I was only on the new brand of DIM for 3 or 4 days before the blood work too. Plus my total T was even higher than when E2 was around 50.
I guess this could be a fluke or a the lab could have made a mistake but I doubt it. Here is a link to the brand DIM that worked:
Just thought I would pass this along for anyone wanting to try DIM. These results were while taking 1 pill a day. I will let you know after my next blood test but it may be a while, insurance is changing and have to drive a long way to the lab now.
Here's my protocol: 0.80 ml T-cyp once a week, 400 iu of HCG (Novarel) for the 4 days prior to T-cyp injection. Bloodwork drawn 2 days after T-cyp injection when total T should be peaking.
I have been on this for about 3 months now. My total T levels have been running around 670 which is right where Dr. Shippen wanted it., but my E2 was up to around 50 pg/mL. I started taking 30 mg zinc chelate once a day and 1 DIM by Nature's Way. E2 didnt budge. Tried 2 DIM a day. Still no change. Then switched to the one pill a day of the DIM brand Phil has suggested and what a difference it seems to have made. Just got my labs back and total T was 747 while E2 dropped to 35 pg/mL. I was only on the new brand of DIM for 3 or 4 days before the blood work too. Plus my total T was even higher than when E2 was around 50.
I guess this could be a fluke or a the lab could have made a mistake but I doubt it. Here is a link to the brand DIM that worked:
Just thought I would pass this along for anyone wanting to try DIM. These results were while taking 1 pill a day. I will let you know after my next blood test but it may be a while, insurance is changing and have to drive a long way to the lab now.
That is 100IU daily for each of the four days prior to T, for the total of 400IU per week, correct?
Or it is 400IU daily, for the total of 4*400=1600IU per week?
If it is 400IU, is it long term dose, or short term booster?
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How do you deal with unused Novarel, throw it away or figured out something?
Advice on Novarel from Dr Shippen was?
Novarel supplied in 10000IU, supposed life is 30 days after oppening.
Use 2000IU within 5 weeks, 32 days between first and last HCG shot.
Thanks for update.
Happy New Year!
It is 400 iu per day for total of 1600 iu per week. For now this is a long term dose not a booster. I was on HCG only therapy (no T-cyp) for about 6 months and kept increasing dosage until I got up to 500 iu per day (3500 iu per week) but I could not get my levels above about 300 total T on that. So Dr. Shjippen went to this combination of HCG and T-cyp. I was on androgel for 4 years prior to seeing Shippen and I think my testicles had atrophy to a point they can not recover. But I don't know for sure what the problem there is because there are also people like Phil who can get a good response from HCG after 20 years on TRT.
I believe Dr. Shippen feels the Novarel is ok for at least 6 weeks despite the box saying 30 days. I have typically used it all up in 6 weeks so have not had to deal with unused product but I guess I would just toss it in the trash. Of course I keep it in the fridge all the time except for a few minutes when I draw my dosage out of the bottle. I think you should be fine using it up in 32 days. The worst case is it may lose some potency but otherwise do no harm.
Last edited by farmerjohn; 12-30-2006 at 02:13 PM.
It is 400 iu per day for total of 1600 iu per week. For now this is a long term dose not a booster. I was on HCG only therapy (no T-cyp) for about 6 months and kept increasing dosage until I got up to 500 iu per day (3500 iu per week) but I could not get my levels above about 300 total T on that. So Dr. Shjippen went to this combination of HCG and T-cyp. I was on androgel for 4 years prior to seeing Shippen and I think my testicles had atrophy to a point they can not recover. But I don't know for sure what the problem there is because there are also people like Phil who can get a good response from HCG after 20 years on TRT.
I believe Dr. Shippen feels the Novarel is ok for at least 6 weeks despite the box saying 30 days. I have typically used it all up in 6 weeks so have not had to deal with unused product but I guess I would just toss it in the trash. Of course I keep it in the fridge all the time except for a few minutes when I draw my dosage out of the bottle. I think you should be fine using it up in 32 days. The worst case is it may lose some potency but otherwise do no harm.
What was your T level when you first realised that you need to increase it, what was the origin of your problem?
Or did you messed it up by using something, what was it?
Around the age of 40 when my wife and I were trying to have a 2nd child I noticed when I had to perform at a moments notice that it wasnt as easy as it used to be. She had fertility problems too so her fertile time was very short and it meant I had to be ready at any moment. As time progressed I noticed worsening lack of libido and ocassional ED. Eventually after doing some reading I realized I must have low T. Went to a urologist to have it checked and it was 98 on the first check, 135 on the second. He put me on androgel. I had to take 10g a day to get up to the 500's. I asked about clomid and HCG but was told they did not work. I got a second opinion with the same answers from another urologist. I stayed on the androgel 4 years before seeing Dr. Shippen. The androgel worked ok at first and at times worked pretty good but I would have long periods, weeks to months of low libido and ED symptoms. As far as I know I did not take anything to cause this. I was on some controversial antibiotic for about a month for a possible prostate infection not long before it started but I doubt that is related. I plan to start another thread soon about a possible cause of secondary hypogonadism due to having one of the hemochromatosis gene defects which I happen to have, even though I do not have hemochromatosis.
As of now the origin of my problem is unknown like many of us with secondary hypogonadism. I never took any steriods, never had a head injury, no pituitary adenoma that can be found on an MRI, etc etc....
Last edited by farmerjohn; 12-31-2006 at 02:50 PM.
To be honest, not a huge change in any other way. When my E2 was high (around 50 pg/mL) it did not seem to have a big negative effect on me like it has on others. But I was concerned about the possible future gyno and in particular I was very concerned about having high E2 and it eventually causing prostate cancer. Shippen tells me if your E2 is high and you get prostate cancer it is much more likely to be an agressive form of it.
I have noticed moring wood more often and easier erections. My wife tells me my modd is better, but I have also been having daily headaches from a sinus infection that are starting to resolve at the same time so it's hard to say which was the cause of the mood improvement.
To be honest, not a huge change in any other way. When my E2 was high (around 50 pg/mL) it did not seem to have a big negative effect on me like it has on others. But I was concerned about the possible future gyno and in particular I was very concerned about having high E2 and it eventually causing prostate cancer. Shippen tells me if your E2 is high and you get prostate cancer it is much more likely to be an agressive form of it.
I have noticed moring wood more often and easier erections. My wife tells me my modd is better, but I have also been having daily headaches from a sinus infection that are starting to resolve at the same time so it's hard to say which was the cause of the mood improvement.
Clinical studies looking at serum estradiol levels before and after
BioResponse DIM are only now in progress based on the collaboration
between BioResponse LLC and the National Cancer Institute. Earlier
published work looking at DIM in plasma generated from oral I3C showed
no change in serum estradiol levels. What did change was an increase in
the metabolism of Estrone the less active circulating form of estradiol.
Increased metabolism of Estrone to 2-hydroxy Estrone was found.
So, DIM itself is not a inhibitor of aromatase or a means to lower
estradiol which replaces the use of arimidex. DIM can be taken in
conjunction with arimidex. This helps maintain high 2-hydroxy estrogen
levels which may be beneficial for the prostate gland.
Great response to certain DIM brand 
Linear Mode
