Leydig Cell Regeneration (HCG?)

[Megazoid]

I have been researching this subject for some time in the hope of finding answers for my own condition. Varicoceles cause a progressive degenerative process to ocurr in the testicle and this is triggered by a combination of over-heating (due to stagnated blood flow) and fluctations in DHT/E2 which in turn lead to decrease in sperm production and testicular size.

Alot of the secondary guy's suffer from testicular shrinkage and in turn soft, small testicles. But even the likes of Phil, who is older than 40 (the age where HCG isn't supposed to "work") can still double T levels while using HCG. Why does this happen? Do you we fully understand what HCG is doing to the testicles.

During puberty LH and FSH rise the testicles increase in size. So does HCG have the same effect and cause a regeneration process to occur when body builders and secondary guys use it? Does a cell and tissue regeneration process occur?

Do larger testicles equal higher T level? What causes them to be "soft" some days and "normal" feeling the other (this seem's to happen in secondary guys too) and must correlate somewhat with hormonal levels?

Would be interested in hearing other peoples opinions on this. I am getting blood tests next week then the following week going to start my HCG protocol (250iu daily - 6 weeks, followed by 4 weeks of Nolva - then retest).

[drimmdave]

Do you not know what HCG is? What it does?If you have done your research you would not have to ask the questions you have asked.

[masterpp]

drimdave no need for the flame.

megazoid is familiar with the stimulatory effects of hcg on the testicles, but he is wondering if their is evidence that it causes regrowth of arrested development.

thats all

[farmerjohn]

Dr. Shippen has told me HCG can regenerate Leydig cells in some men, probably in most if they are not too old. He tried HCG solely on me for 6 months before deciding I had waited long enough to get my T up to normal and now I am on HCG and T-cyp. I am 47 so at least up to the late 40's he feels HCG should regenerate. I was on androgel for 4 years before seeing him which is why I had fairly bad atrophy and also probably why the HCG did not completely work for me. It did get me up to about 300 total T when I started out around 100 though.

I'm not sure why the testicles would be soft some days and harder others. I have noticed if sexually excited they tend to be harder but don't know if that is a coincidence or not. I'm also secondary by the way.

[Megazoid]

Special thanks for the reply's guys.

Master, you've summed it up in one sentance. I guess i am wondering if HCG can cause a regeneration process to occur in the testicular cells and more so the leydig cells. I was thinking about your own situation too and i am wondering if a high dosage of HCG would be enough to regenerate the leydig cells in your case? Maybe something like 2500/3000iu in one shot or a few 1000iu shots each week then rechecking. This stuff is potent and i can't see why it wouldn't work because we are both young. Not saying your levels would go back to normal or anything but you might get some good mood and libido improvements.

Farmerjohn - Special thanks for your input. Did you regain "normal" nut size while using HCG? Or were your nut's too atrophied? Do your testicles ever go between being somewhat "soft" and "mushy" (for lack of a better word) and "normal" feeling at times too (even a "size" change)? This might seem like a bit of a strange one, but did you notice any scrotum/penis skin changes when your nut's were atrophied? I have noticed a definite lack of blood flow in the whole area which might correlate well with the low t in turn causing bad prepherial blood flow (DHT related?).

[drimmdave]

Sorry for the snarky post,I guess i didn't think it through all the way, i'll try and adjust my attitude.

Dave

[novicebb]

Originally Posted by Megazoid

I have been researching this subject for some time in the hope of finding answers for my own condition. Varicoceles cause a progressive degenerative process to ocurr in the testicle and this is triggered by a combination of over-heating (due to stagnated blood flow) and fluctations in DHT/E2 which in turn lead to decrease in sperm production and testicular size.

Alot of the secondary guy's suffer from testicular shrinkage and in turn soft, small testicles. But even the likes of Phil, who is older than 40 (the age where HCG isn't supposed to "work") can still double T levels while using HCG. Why does this happen? Do you we fully understand what HCG is doing to the testicles.

During puberty LH and FSH rise the testicles increase in size. So does HCG have the same effect and cause a regeneration process to occur when body builders and secondary guys use it? Does a cell and tissue regeneration process occur?

Do larger testicles equal higher T level? What causes them to be "soft" some days and "normal" feeling the other (this seem's to happen in secondary guys too) and must correlate somewhat with hormonal levels?

Would be interested in hearing other peoples opinions on this. I am getting blood tests next week then the following week going to start my HCG protocol (250iu daily - 6 weeks, followed by 4 weeks of Nolva - then retest).

You keep saying Secondary guys do you mean "sedentary" guys?

[kincaiddave]

Originally Posted by novicebb

You keep saying Secondary guys do you mean "sedentary" guys?

He is referring to someone with Secondary Hypogonadism. My definition of a secondary guy is someone that has functioning testicles, yet has low testosterone levels.

[dano79]

I was on testosterone for almost two years before I started HCG. Is that too long of a time?

[farmerjohn]

Megazoid, my testicles did increase in size and firmness substantially after I started HCG. I noticed a difference fairly quickly, like in a couple months or less. I can not say for sure (since I never measured them before or after) but I don't think they are back to the full size they were when I was in my 30's and younger before all this started. I have noticed they seem to be less firm some days but have wondered if it was my imagination or what. Before I started HCG (while on androgel alone) my scrotum would usually be very tight and my testicles would actually try to push up inside my body unless I had just taken a hot bath or something. I know the scrotum's purpose is to control the temp of the testicles but mine always seemed to be too cold I guess. I found this very annoying. During sex they would even kind of be in the way they were so far pushed up inside me.

Dano, I can not say if being on T for almost 2 years is too long. I think it varies for every person. But the sooner you start HCG the better. I put off finding a doctor that would prescribe it way too long. Don't procrastinate. If youre going to do it, do it now. I think you can find plenty of guys who were on T for 2 years and HCG still worked great for them. In my case I was on it 4 and while it does not get my T to normal by itself, it does work to some extent and my hope (probbaly false hope) is that over another years time or so the leydig cells will continue to regenerate and I will be able to reduce the T-cyp more and more.