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Men's Health Forum: This is a discussion on Reverse T negative feedback within the Anabolic Steroids forums, part of the extensive steroid information at MESO-Rx; Could this old drug find be revolutionary to bodybuilding and anti-aging medicine? http://endo.endojournals.org/cgi/con...ll/141/11/3940 What exactly is Baclofen: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baclofen Yes, I ...

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Old 08-02-2007, 07:19 PM
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Default Reverse T negative feedback

Could this old drug find be revolutionary to bodybuilding and anti-aging medicine?

http://endo.endojournals.org/cgi/con...ll/141/11/3940

What exactly is Baclofen:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baclofen

Yes, I know, the study was referring to intrathecal Baclofen. However, Baclofen is available in pill form for a very low cost of around .20 - .40 per tablet...very cheap! Here in the USA named Lioresal.

Ok, so does the pill form cross the BBB:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/en...t=AbstractPlus

The only hitch, I can't find any human studies. Anyone here tried it in their program in lieu of HCG?

Man, if this works in humans and eliminates the T Negative feedback this will be BIG NEWS.

My doctor will easily prescribe it because it is considered to be a "safe" drug. Just told him my muscles were stiff .

Also, wrote to Swale to get his thoughts.

If this is old news sorry as I don't have much time to monitor/research this board. However, I don't think it is widely known yet. If anyone tries it be sure to report your results. I'm under the impression that the Baclofen muscle relax characteristics counterbalances the T aggressiveness thus, you can increase T and still have the euphoria and build mass without the desire to kill - Lol!

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Old 08-02-2007, 08:10 PM
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Default Re: Reverse T negative feedback

Sorry, here is the first link again. Don't know why it didn't work the first time:

http://endo.endojournals.org/cgi/con...ll/141/11/3940
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Old 08-03-2007, 03:39 AM
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Default Re: Reverse T negative feedback

The news just seems to be getting better and better:

Also looks like Baclofen raises IGF-I and it appears this study was with the pills. Ok, let me see,,,,so it raises LH, FSH, Testosterone, IGF-I naturally and you can also use testosterone with no negative feedback and all this for pennies a pill. Someone help me here.....Am I dreaming or what?

Here is another study....

And there are more

http://jcp.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/46/4/476
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Old 08-03-2007, 04:18 AM
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Default Re: Reverse T negative feedback

Unless the good doctor Swales convinces me otherwise, I think my initial protocol will be...

10 mg/d for 30 days. Then get my LH and FSH blood test. (I already have my baseline) Because LH and FSH tend to pulsate I will do three tests of each 30 minutes apart and average. Assuming the Baclofen works, I will focus on my LH with FSH to be considered. I want my LH to be like that of a 19 year old (3.6-5.3 mIU/mL).

After test results, if my LH needs to be higher, then I will bump up my Baclofen dose accordingly. Assuming I achieve my optimal LH level, then, I will determine if I need to begin Androgel. Obviously, if my T is not optimal when/if I reach my optimal LH level then, I will begin Androgel.
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Old 08-03-2007, 04:56 AM
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Default Re: Reverse T negative feedback

FYI...Here in the USA, CVS only carries the generic. However, here is a better pricing example for generic, or brand, name and where I buy my scripts:

http://www.canadadrugs.com/search.ph...esal&x=25&y=11
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Old 08-03-2007, 05:41 AM
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Default Re: Reverse T negative feedback

It just keeps getting better and better:

"Our results demonstrated that, in our experimental model, neither concentration affected previous neuronal survival. Considering the above results, we can conclude that at the used concentrations, this drug is safe and its clinical use should be encouraged."

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...cc21a85a3218b4

Also, no ED side effects like SERMS.

For photos of the pill, manufacturers, and more info:

http://www.drugdigest.org/DD/DVH/Uses/0,3915,64|Lioresal,00.html#howToTake
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Old 08-03-2007, 10:22 AM
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Default Re: Reverse T negative feedback

I have never found Baclofen to worth anything at all but I took it for back pain.
Intrestingn study alrite The questionably parts are the doseage and species differences. Hope you continue researching this. Meanwhile I found a bottle of Baclofen in the back of a drawer, I`ll let you know

Last edited by zkt; 08-03-2007 at 10:35 AM.
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Old 08-03-2007, 03:34 PM
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Default Re: Reverse T negative feedback

Yes, please let me know. I will start next week and will post my initial results within 2-4 weeks. The more research, the more this seems like "The Magic Pill"... who said it didn't exist?

I am just beyond belief that the anti-aging doc's were not aware of these studies. I believe their lack of knowledge about this drug is because this is a relatively older drug and the patents have run out ( which is why it's so cheap). The anti-aging doc's are always looking for the next great thing but failed to look at the older drugs and studies how they might apply to anti-aging, I have been researching for several years and countless hours and just now discovered it. My doc is about to jump through the roof with the info I gave him. I have already let Swale know as well. I'm sure word will travel fast and we will start getting people to report their labs to confirm or deny the studies.

Anyway, this drug must have gotten overlooked in the process and maybe by intent. Imagine, If this drug does what science says/implies it can do, the other high cost drugs that it may hurt such as HGH, IGF-I , HMG and the more moderately priced drugs like T and HCG.

It makes me wonder if I'm not shooting myself in the foot here because if this catches on like I suspect it will, then they may pull it from the market or put up a fight to have it pulled or made illegal.

For patients with Andropause (not body builders), there is a possibility that one may not even need T as this drug is supposed to increase T with LH increase.

While I realize much of this is just speculation (as my research is ongoing) and I probably should contain my excitement, It is difficult to do so as there is much more that I know and have not reported here about the qualities/studies regarding this drug.

Therefore, to those Doc's who might hammer me for sticking my neck out there, excuse my excitement as I agree that more research and personal trails need to occur before we can come to a conclusion.

Also, for those already on T be careful. I would substantially reduce your T before trying this drug as it could shoot your T through the roof as your LH comes back to life. You can always bump your T back up again, but IMHO, it is better to not gamble until your labs tell the story. Also, I would not do HCG with this drug. HCG mimics LH, this drug increases the real LH which means you can monitor it with your LH labs unlike HCG and no needle!
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Old 08-03-2007, 04:02 PM
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Default Re: Reverse T negative feedback

Got a clue as to the doseage ?
Where are you going to strt ?
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Old 08-03-2007, 06:16 PM
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Default Re: Reverse T negative feedback

Deferring to the following link you will note:

Dosage And Administration: The determination of baclofen's optimal dosage requires individual titration. Start therapy at a low dosage and increase gradually until optimum effect is achieved (usually between 40 to 80 mg daily).

The following dosage titration schedule is suggested: 5 mg 3 times daily for 3 days; 10 mg 3 times daily for 3 days; 15 mg 3 times daily for 3 days; 20 mg 3 times daily for 3 days.

Thereafter, additional increases may be necessary but the total daily dose should not exceed a maximum of 80 mg daily (20 mg 4 times daily).

Utilize the lowest dose compatible with an optimal response. If benefits are not evident after a reasonable trial period, withdraw patients slowly from the drug (see Warnings).

http://www.rxmed.com/b.main/b2.pharm.../LIORESAL.html
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