Men's Health Forum: This is a discussion on So Frustrated!! within the Anabolic Steroids forums, part of the extensive steroid information at MESO-Rx; No doctors can get my FT to raise above v.v low levels. My TT can be very high, but FT ...
No doctors can get my FT to raise above v.v low levels. My TT can be very high, but FT will not go up. (SHBG is vv low as well) Actually the higher TT goes, the lower FT goes. I had E2, Estrone and Estriol tested and they are all low normal. I have experimented with AI’s DIM and TMG and they all make me feel worse. I have no libido, shriveled penis and basically feel terrible all the time. I have contacted Dr John asking for an online consult (no response yet)cause I have had so many test and seen so many doctors, no one has the vaguest idea what is wrong with me. It just does not make scientific sense to me, put more test in and FT will rise, as long as E2 is in check, and it definitely is.
I am so frustrated, I have been like this for 1.5 years, no sign of getting better.
Have you checked all the other testosterone binding protiens like Albumin and whatever other ones there may be? I assume all your other tests, such as liver panel, kidney function, CBC and such, are all okay. If your total test is high and your FT is low then that extra Testosterone has to be somewhere or it wouldn't show up in the total T values. You just have to figure out where it's bound.
As far as I understand it, once T is converted to E2 it is no longer part of the total or free T lab values. So controlling E2 is only going to raise your total T but not affect how it is bound or processed in the body. Controlling
E2 might raise your Free T if your other protiens are in balance but if you have very high Albumin, or any other test binding protien, levels then this can drive down your Free T even if your total T is high. IMO it doesn't seem like your problem is with Testosterone metabolites like E2 or DHT. I'd look into other proteins.
You may want to get your labs done by a different lab as well. When I first tested my Testosterone the lab I used showed my T levels as being low normal. Upon a retest at a different lab (a regional lab in Utah – ARUP) my levels were less than 1/3 the lower ref. range value. When I asked the first lab what may have happened they said that they were having problems with their equipment and had since stopped doing Testosterone in-house. Perhaps your lab has a problem they don’t know about.
Plus, if you are currently taking Gels make sure they don’t draw from the same place you apply the gel. I don’t think you’d do that but it’s just something to think about.
I started on TRT with this problem. My free T was below ref ranges but total was around 500. I felt like terrible, low libido, no energy. But TRT has raises my free T to normal ranges. Let us know what Dr. John suggests.
Have you checked all the other testosterone binding protiens like Albumin and whatever other ones there may be? I assume all your other tests, such as liver panel, kidney function, CBC and such, are all okay. If your total test is high and your FT is low then that extra Testosterone has to be somewhere or it wouldn't show up in the total T values. You just have to figure out where it's bound.
As far as I understand it, once T is converted to E2 it is no longer part of the total or free T lab values. So controlling E2 is only going to raise your total T but not affect how it is bound or processed in the body. Controlling
E2 might raise your Free T if your other protiens are in balance but if you have very high Albumin, or any other test binding protien, levels then this can drive down your Free T even if your total T is high. IMO it doesn't seem like your problem is with Testosterone metabolites like E2 or DHT. I'd look into other proteins.
You may want to get your labs done by a different lab as well. When I first tested my Testosterone the lab I used showed my T levels as being low normal. Upon a retest at a different lab (a regional lab in Utah – ARUP) my levels were less than 1/3 the lower ref. range value. When I asked the first lab what may have happened they said that they were having problems with their equipment and had since stopped doing Testosterone in-house. Perhaps your lab has a problem they don’t know about.
Plus, if you are currently taking Gels make sure they don’t draw from the same place you apply the gel. I don’t think you’d do that but it’s just something to think about.
Yeah I have had liver panel done, Albumin was within normal ranges, so it cant be that. Not sure if i have had a CBC and what is a kidney panel, these are test for proteins? What other proteins does test bind to other than Albumin, I thought Albumin was basically the only one?
Stinging Nettle is supposed to raise free test but it binds to SHBG and if yours is low then I guess this wont help any.
Has some antiaromatase function too but not too heavy.
You may want to get your labs done by a different lab as well. When I first tested my Testosterone the lab I used showed my T levels as being low normal.
Definitely good advice. If something is really unusual you should have at least multiple tests (is this result from one 1 test? - it sounds like something you are getting continuously - how many times? what are the results?) and possibly different labs too - particularly with something this 'out of whack'.
I got messed up results (but very obviously) and when I talked to a nurse the next time I went in she said the tests are quite sensitive and even the way in which the blood is drawn and handled can potentially effect the results. So again, with strange results, I'd try to even get blood drawn by a different person.
have you had Prolactin also what are you doing for TRT and what is your Total and Free T and any other tests you had. Post them if you can with the units and ranges.
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Elevated SHBG will lower Free T. Lowering SHBG will raise Free T.
But you're saying that you have very low Free T *AND* very low SHBG. That just sounds wrong to me unless I'm missing something.
I agree that you should get additional tests with a new lab.
Exactly, that is what is so frustrating. (I have had tests done by 3 different labs - money is no object, company pays all). TT normal, FT low, SHBG low.
Like I said Before scientifically this does not make sense, i put test in and it's there as TT but not FT. The test must be binding to something else, that why i ask what else does test bind to? I know Albumin, my Albumin levels are high normal, so dont think it would be that. I have heavily used oral steroids in the past so it is very possible my kidnesy/liver are not in good order
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Frustration and Adrenal Fatigue
Quote:
Originally Posted by zadok
No doctors can get my FT to raise above v.v low levels. My TT can be very high, but FT will not go up. (SHBG is vv low as well) Actually the higher TT goes, the lower FT goes. I had E2, Estrone and Estriol tested and they are all low normal. I am so frustrated, I have been like this for 1.5 years, no sign of getting better.
When bioavailable testosterone levels and total testosterone levels and estrogen levels are good but sexual dysfunction/depression/anxiety/frustration/etc. persists, then the most important step I've found is to check for adrenal fatigue.
When many of my patients describe feeling "frustrated", "desperate", "crabby", "grouchy", "moody", "snappy", "touchy" - when they are irritable, have frequent mood swings, have frequent panic - I look for adrenal fatigue.
Whenever a patient repeatedly calls me in a crisis, I look for adrenal fatigue.
The inability to maintain a stable temper or mood often indicates that one's ability to adapt to stress is overwhelmed or impaired.
The adrenal glands - which are specialized components of the peripheral nervous system like the hypothalamus is a specialized component of the central nervous system - are one of the main components of our body which allows us to adapt to stress.
When the adrenal glands are well-functioning, but stress is very high, the excessively high cortisol levels produced can cause depression, mood instability, and psychosis. The high cortisol levels can cause insulin resistance, which then lower testosterone production and cause sexual dysfunction.
When the adrenal glands are worn down by chronic stress, the low cortisol levels produced (as well as low levels of the about 150 different neurotransmitters and hormones produced), lead to mood instability, depression, anxiety, low testosterone production - and sexual dysfunction.
(reposted in adrenal thread)
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