TRT with adrenal issues?

[s0b]

CFS endurance training. Wow.

What did you develop CFS from ?? EBV/CMV or HHV6 or some enterovirus?? or some other infection??

Did you do any antiviral or immune modulating treatment up to now??

Why would you do endurance training?? This lowers testo levels markedly. Many people reach overtraining after CFS easier than others. Many endurance athletes reach overtraining too. Parasympathetic type that is. In either case you should take long breaks from endurance training, to give your body a chance to recover T levels. Or boost them with some resistance training or SERM as you did.

Who knows maybe you did develop adrenal issues,CFS patients do have them but its mostly a of central origin the damage to the HPA axis.

Will write more in the future if you give out more details

Take care

[EnduroMan]

Originally Posted by s0b

CFS endurance training. Wow.

What did you develop CFS from ?? EBV/CMV or HHV6 or some enterovirus?? or some other infection??

Did you do any antiviral or immune modulating treatment up to now??

Why would you do endurance training?? This lowers testo levels markedly. Many people reach overtraining after CFS easier than others. Many endurance athletes reach overtraining too. Parasympathetic type that is. In either case you should take long breaks from endurance training, to give your body a chance to recover T levels. Or boost them with some resistance training or SERM as you did.

Who knows maybe you did develop adrenal issues,CFS patients do have them but its mostly a of central origin the damage to the HPA axis.

Will write more in the future if you give out more details

Take care

Hi s0b,

Yes I developed CFS after mononucleosis when I was 10. It was more of an insidious onset than an instant crash after the mono, a bit like I recovered from it but perhaps did not quite feel myself after that then CFS symptoms crept in.

I am not a bodybuilder at heart lol, before I was ill I was highly active and competitive in my age category in two or three sports at national level. Cycling was my favourite and is just what I wanted to do and still do. I am fully aware that hard and long endurance training drops testosterone levels and can lead to overtraining and adrenal issues though I really am very careful not to "push it" and slide down the slippery slope.

Your point about taking long breaks to give testosterone levels to recover is very valid and although relatively speaking my training volume is quite low I have taken breaks of 6 weeks or longer from time to time. Unfortunately during these breaks I feel no better (just the same as I normally would do after a day or so rest after training) and still experience the fatigue leading me to believe that the endurance training is not the primary cause of it.

Even still the recent morning blood test to check T levels was taken after an 10 day proper break from training and also staying away from stress as much as I could during this time leading up to it. This was done delibrately so that the training would not influence the results even if it did take longer, and I'm not sure T levels will get any higher than this with any amount of rest but I could be wrong. More blood was taken this morning to retest T and also LH and FSH, results will be posted on here when they come back.

As for antiviral or immune modulating treatment, no I have never been treated by these and am not on any medication curently. Amongst many other things including benzodiazepines I was on trimipramine at 100mg daily for several years from age 13.

Thank you very much for the input

Cheers

[SPONGEBRAIN]

genova diagnostics are pretty reasonable on their bloods

also we only get 9am cortisol tests done here for some reason!..weird?

dr peatfield is the adrenals guy in the uk if you wanna give him a shout...

[AlexanderDenmark]

If your adrenals are shot, it's also worth testing your thyroid too. Adrenals and thyroid goes hand in hand.

[EnduroMan]

Originally Posted by SPONGEBRAIN

genova diagnostics are pretty reasonable on their bloods

also we only get 9am cortisol tests done here for some reason!..weird?

dr peatfield is the adrenals guy in the uk if you wanna give him a shout...

Hi SPONGEBRAIN and AlexanderDenmark,

I have considered GD for bloods. I assume am probably wanting the Adrenal - Thyroid Profile test Adrenal - Thyroid Profile - Diagnostic Laboratory Testing for Wellness & Preventive Medicine - Genova Diagnostics. Is that the correct test?

I assume this can be done without the practitioner getting involved? Nice guy but getting him to take bloods is like trying to get blood from a stone! He won't test for half of what Swale tests for without really pushing him, but then who am I to tell him what to do anyway.

Thanks guys

[AlexanderDenmark]

Good test for adrenals, but not complete for thyroid. The urinary for t3 seems like a good idea, but more comprehensive thyroid testing would need serum

Total t4
Total T3
Free t4
Free t3
Reverse t3
Thyroid antibodieas
TSH

[JimRat]

EnduroMan, I can relate to your history. I was a very healthy and active athlete until I had mono about three years ago. Like you, I recovered from acute mono in a couple of weeks but began a slow slide afterward from which I have not fully recovered.

Oddly enough, I was IGM positive for EBV a full year after the initial mono episode. This suggests that the infection had entered some kind of chronic manifestation. The EBV is just one part of the puzzle though. It seems lyme disease was there all along...perhaps enabling the otherwise common EBV virus to take hold and proliferate.

Some three years later I'm still not right but I cope well and still work full-time and keep regular exercise routines, which is crucial.

My chief complaint is still my sexual functioning. Desire/libido is there but I did lose some testicular volume. My LH/FSH have been chronically low suggesting that infection/s impacted pituitary negatively. HCG hasn't helped in this regard. Clomid did help nicely but is not indicated for long-term use.

I did resolve some of my symptoms through longterm antibiotics. I have been unable to determine by which mechanism these infections affect the how hormones are used in the body. It has been suggested that toxins from bacterial/viral die-off may cause receptor blockade.

Certainly, adrenal fatigue may play a role but three months of Cortef failed to result in a change for me.

You may have thyroid issues too. If so, T3 only therapy may be worth a try (even though controversial). There is only anecdotal evidence to support the use of T3 only but Dr. Wilson suggested that traumatic events can lock the body in a defensive response so-to-speak. This response leads to higher RT3 levels and less optimized T3 use by the body.

Other suggestions:

Rule out additional infections (they have plenty of tick-borne infections in Europe too)
Try Valtrex therapy for several months (Check current virus load, including HHV-6, Valcyte hits HHV-6)
Try cortisol if tests warrant (in conjunction with thyroid replacement and/or T3 if needed)

My EBV titers are still high on the IGG side but I may try several months of Valtrex as a means of making any active virus dormant again...

Good luck...

[EnduroMan]

Originally Posted by JimRat

You may have thyroid issues too. If so, T3 only therapy may be worth a try (even though controversial). There is only anecdotal evidence to support the use of T3 only but Dr. Wilson suggested that traumatic events can lock the body in a defensive response so-to-speak. This response leads to higher RT3 levels and less optimized T3 use by the body.

Other suggestions:

Rule out additional infections (they have plenty of tick-borne infections in Europe too)
Try Valtrex therapy for several months (Check current virus load, including HHV-6, Valcyte hits HHV-6)
Try cortisol if tests warrant (in conjunction with thyroid replacement and/or T3 if needed)

My EBV titers are still high on the IGG side but I may try several months of Valtrex as a means of making any active virus dormant again...

Good luck...

Thanks JimRat they are the kind of things I need to know. Actually a couple of friends of mine have had Lyme disease from ticks they have picked up when outdoors over the years.

I have a couple of questions for those who can answer;

Is the E2 "extraction method" or "ultra-sensitive" test available in the UK? So far the endo has not asked for E2 to be checked at all but I will push for it.

Does anyone know what all I should be asking my Endo for when I next see him as I feel that he might not be thorough enough?

Should I be asking him to take all the same blood tests as SWALE does if I can get him to? Just wanting to make sure that everything is covered and nothing is left out.

Thanks again guys.

[EnduroMan]

Just an quick update.

The lab results have come back today and the endo had asked his secretary to call me and arrange an MRI scan for my pitutary. Did not get the results myself but will try to on Friday when I go for the scan.

[EnduroMan]

Originally Posted by EnduroMan

Just an quick update.

The lab results have come back today and the endo had asked his secretary to call me and arrange an MRI scan for my pitutary. Did not get the results myself but will try to on Friday when I go for the scan.

Recieved the lab results today as the endo had sent them out to me in the post.

Testosterone 4.8
LH 0.6
FSH 1.5
Prolactin 266

The prolactin seems unusually high however I am in the UK and perhaps it is measured differently here to what it typically is in the USA (like it is with testosterone)?

MRI scan is this Friday.