Thyroid Hormone and Testicular function (Excellent article)

[masterpp]

interesting theory-

by the way mega what was ur tsh and what was your t3 and t4- and your cortisol whilst your at it

and since starting the thyroid therapy have you gained any weight by chance

[Megazoid]

Found this tonight:

Thyroid hormones: their role in testicular steroid...[Arch Androl. 2003 Sep-Oct] - PubMed Result

Some very important and intresting quotes:

"T3 directly increases Leydig cell LH receptor numbers and mRNA levels of steroidogenic enzymes and steroidogenic acute regulatory protein. It stimulates basal and LH-induced secretion of progesterone, testosterone, and estradiol by Leydig cells. Steroidogenic factor-1 acts as a mediator for T3-induced Leydig cell steroidogenesis. Although the role of T3 on sperm, germ, and peritubular cells has not yet been completely studied, it is clear that T3 directly regulates Sertoli and Leydig cell functions."

Testicular dysfunction in men with primary hypothy...[Clin Endocrinol (Oxf). 2000] - PubMed Result

"OBJECTIVE: Primary hypothyroidism can cause disturbances in normal gonadal function. The aim of this study was to investigate the relationship in men between hypogonadism and primary hypothyroidism and the extent to which free and total testosterone levels rose after introduction of replacement thyroxine. DESIGN: Paired study of patients in a hypothyroid and thyroxine treated state. PATIENTS: Ten men with primary hypothyroidism. MEASUREMENTS: Free and total testosterone, gonadotrophin and prolactin levels before and after thyroxine replacement therapy. RESULTS: Low free testosterone levels (161 +/- 62 pmol/l) demonstrated at the time the men were hypothyroid rose significantly with the commencement of thyroxine replacement (315 +/- 141 pmol/l; P < 0.001). Gonadotrophin levels were not elevated consistent with hypogonadotrophic hypogonadism. Hyperprolactinaemia, which can occur in primary hypothyroidism and cause hypogonadotrophic hypogonadism, was not present in the majority of these patients. However a reduction in prolactin level was evident with thyroxine replacement and a rise in free testosterone levels. CONCLUSION: This suggests an effect of hypothyroidism on gonadotrophin secretion at the level of the hypothalamus-pituitary, either directly or through modulation of prolactin secretion. Low free testosterone may also be a contributing factor to some of the symptoms and signs of hypothyroidism in men."

[Recless]

Wow great find Mega! I beleive this to be true...Dr. M has made mention of this as well, hypothyroidism leads to a reduction in steroid hormone production from the testes - particularly a reduction in testosterone production, then estrogen production.

[onewaypockets]

Hi Mega and All,

Wouldn't Armour natural thyroid be a good choice for this situation? Since it contains a pretty big slug of T3 also, it could more directly stimulate the testis?

Just a thought...

Neil

[pmgamer18]

Yes Armour or any med that raises T3 will help but this takes over a yr. to get balanced. As you add meds your TSH goes down much the same as you LH and FSH does on TRT. So the problem is you can't take a high dose of thyroid meds like you can testosterone. One needs to go up on the dose slow. When you start on Armour like 60mgs or one grain you feel better for about 2 weeks then you go back to being hypo this is when you add more. Now the hard part if you have good adrenals you can go up 30 mgs at about every 2 weeks but if your adrenals are bad you can't go up much more then 15 mgs at a time. After you get up to 2.5 grains now you need to hold for about 6 weeks before going up on the dose. I have been at this over a yr. now and I am up to 3.5 grains and still my labs not great Free T3 is 382 range 230 to 420 pg/dl down form 382 on 3 grains. My Free T4 is 1 range .8 to 1.8 ng/dl up from .9 on 3 grains. This blows my mind and I am looking into this.

So this is why Dr. M will not treat low testosterone if you have a bad Thyroid or bad adrenals when you fix this your levels should come back up on testosterone. Problem is it takes a dam long the time to fix thyroid and adrenals.

Originally Posted by onewaypockets

Hi Mega and All,

Wouldn't Armour natural thyroid be a good choice for this situation? Since it contains a pretty big slug of T3 also, it could more directly stimulate the testis?

Just a thought...

Neil

[masterpp]

should we interpret the statements about the relationship between t production and thyroid as being on a pituitary or testicular level (ie primary or secondary hypogonadism)

Originally Posted by Megazoid

Found this tonight:

Thyroid hormones: their role in testicular steroid...[Arch Androl. 2003 Sep-Oct] - PubMed Result

Some very important and intresting quotes:

"T3 directly increases Leydig cell LH receptor numbers and mRNA levels of steroidogenic enzymes and steroidogenic acute regulatory protein. It stimulates basal and LH-induced secretion of progesterone, testosterone, and estradiol by Leydig cells. Steroidogenic factor-1 acts as a mediator for T3-induced Leydig cell steroidogenesis. Although the role of T3 on sperm, germ, and peritubular cells has not yet been completely studied, it is clear that T3 directly regulates Sertoli and Leydig cell functions."

Testicular dysfunction in men with primary hypothy...[Clin Endocrinol (Oxf). 2000] - PubMed Result

"OBJECTIVE: Primary hypothyroidism can cause disturbances in normal gonadal function. The aim of this study was to investigate the relationship in men between hypogonadism and primary hypothyroidism and the extent to which free and total testosterone levels rose after introduction of replacement thyroxine. DESIGN: Paired study of patients in a hypothyroid and thyroxine treated state. PATIENTS: Ten men with primary hypothyroidism. MEASUREMENTS: Free and total testosterone, gonadotrophin and prolactin levels before and after thyroxine replacement therapy. RESULTS: Low free testosterone levels (161 +/- 62 pmol/l) demonstrated at the time the men were hypothyroid rose significantly with the commencement of thyroxine replacement (315 +/- 141 pmol/l; P < 0.001). Gonadotrophin levels were not elevated consistent with hypogonadotrophic hypogonadism. Hyperprolactinaemia, which can occur in primary hypothyroidism and cause hypogonadotrophic hypogonadism, was not present in the majority of these patients. However a reduction in prolactin level was evident with thyroxine replacement and a rise in free testosterone levels. CONCLUSION: This suggests an effect of hypothyroidism on gonadotrophin secretion at the level of the hypothalamus-pituitary, either directly or through modulation of prolactin secretion. Low free testosterone may also be a contributing factor to some of the symptoms and signs of hypothyroidism in men."

[HeadDoc]

good find.

[JimRat]

I started HCG at 3x per week 500 IUs about 4 weeks ago and haven't noticed any return in testicle size. Can anyone discuss how long it takes to regain size with HCG. The strange thing is that my T is going up but testicle size is static and they are still way too soft. 3 weeks in the blood test showed total T was up to about 700 and climbing I presume so I'm wondering why testicles are not showing growth. It seemed like the testicles were marginally better while on clomid.

Is it sperm production? From what I've heard, sperm production may take upwards of three months to restart. Or is my dose too low?

I'm also being treated for hypothyroidism so the above article is of concern.

Thanks guys.

[researchin]

I've treated hypothyroidism successfully for almost 2 years now.

And absolutely NO results in the sex hormones.

I need better labs, but that's my approximation. My LH & FSH are not related to my T3 in any way. Pretty soon they will both be rock bottom 0. My libido is fantastic however. My "T" could be higher. I'll post labs tomorrow.

I have to read all of those articles in depth. I believe there are "gotchyas" to them, that state only particular scenarios where it would work.

Perhaps it's even related to the root of your hypothyroidism, what is the cause.

I wish Docs would research and investigate more often THE CAUSE. It's key.

[zkt]

Jimrat, dont expect immediate results in mass. Your increasing T levels indicate that thee boys are listening to the signals- and thats a good thing- patience.

Researchin, I dont understand your comments. There is not one size(Dx,Rx,Px) that fits all. I assure you that, as one who is currently wading thru 437 clinical studies concerning dietary factors and arterial restenosis, that the Docs are following tried and true scientific methodology. Sorry to say that perhaps your dismay involves a lack of foundation and impatience.