Is Tribulus Terristris out of the question?

[4-D]

I read somewhere that TRT causes the body to stop producing its own T. So I am trying a 45% protodioscin Tribulus Terrestris to naturally increase my own T levels.

Being new to this forum and new to all the different terms and usages thereof, I am under the impression that I am wasting my time and money with Tribulus.

Any thoughts or opinions?

[pmgamer18]

Originally Posted by 4-D

I read somewhere that TRT causes the body to stop producing its own T. So I am trying a 45% protodioscin Tribulus Terrestris to naturally increase my own T levels.

Being new to this forum and new to all the different terms and usages thereof, I am under the impression that I am wasting my time and money with Tribulus.

Any thoughts or opinions?

You do need to get tested first and for me doing things like this to raise T levels was a waste of money. I can't help you with the cost of Dr.'s visits or tests my BCBS pays for it but there are guys in your shoes that can save you some money on Tests. You need to see a Dr. when you start to have problems with ED this can be something else wrong. Do see a Dr..

[Sunkist]

One undertakes TRT to raise levels of T in the body to optimal, not normal. To me it is a fundamental that normal TT is not part of TRT.

I take Trib with my TRT reg. I think it is one of the most positive adjunctives I do along with natural anti aromitazes.

As Phil said, get some levels. One cannot shoot in the dark.

[chap]

I have never seen any studies that show that Tribulus increases testosterone levels... it may have positive results with libido function in many males, but that may have a mechanism that has nothing at all to do with testosterone.

[greyowl]

Originally Posted by chap

I have never seen any studies that show that Tribulus increases testosterone levels... it may have positive results with libido function in many males, but that may have a mechanism that has nothing at all to do with testosterone.

Yup. The only "study" confirming that trib raises test levels was produced by a manufacturer ... in Bulgaria!

[4-D]

Originally Posted by pmgamer18

You need to see a Dr. when you start to have problems with ED this can be something else wrong. Do see a Dr..

I did. Nothing was found out of the ordinary apart from low T levels. However, in reading many of the posts here, I've learned that a general MD is NOT the person to go to for this problem.

[fister]

If you are going on TRT ditch the trib and go with HCG

[SprintR]

Originally Posted by greyowl

Yup. The only "study" confirming that trib raises test levels was produced by a manufacturer ... in Bulgaria!

And it found that it raised estrogen moreso than testosterone!

[4-D]

Originally Posted by SprintR

And it found that it raised estrogen moreso than testosterone!

Now that's interesting......

I'm brand new to this forum and am learning the lingo and terms. From what I understand, estrogen and/or Estradiol (not sure what the difference is yet) suppresses the benefits of testosterone? I haven't yet learned exactly what estrogen is or how it works, but I understand it's "bad".

So one guy is posting that he takes Trib along with his TRT reg, but others post that it may serve to counteract the benefits of TRT.

Is there a comprehensive explanation somewhere that I can read that will explain all this and help me to understand things like HCG, Estrogen, Estradiol, LH, AI, etc etc etc etc, ad nauseum?

Otherwise, I'm just "shooting in the dark", as Sunkist pointed out. He's right.

Thanks for the comments. Please feel free to post more or PM. It's obvious I have a lot to learn to fix this problem.

[pmgamer18]

Originally Posted by 4-D

Now that's interesting......

I'm brand new to this forum and am learning the lingo and terms. From what I understand, estrogen and/or Estradiol (not sure what the difference is yet) suppresses the benefits of testosterone? I haven't yet learned exactly what estrogen is or how it works, but I understand it's "bad".

So one guy is posting that he takes Trib along with his TRT reg, but others post that it may serve to counteract the benefits of TRT.

Is there a comprehensive explanation somewhere that I can read that will explain all this and help me to understand things like HCG, Estrogen, Estradiol, LH, AI, etc etc etc etc, ad nauseum?

Otherwise, I'm just "shooting in the dark", as Sunkist pointed out. He's right.

Thanks for the comments. Please feel free to post more or PM. It's obvious I have a lot to learn to fix this problem.

4-D I could send you so much stuff on this you would get overwhelmed with it all do read this one it is dam good I don't buy anything from LEF.
http://www.lef.org/protocols/prtcls-...prtcl-130.html
And get to book by Dr. Shippen "The Testosterone Syndorme" this will get your foot in the door on this.

[Sunkist]

Effects of androstenedione-herbal supplementation on serum sex hormone concentrations in 30- to 59-year-old men.

Brown GA, Vukovich MD, Martini ER, Kohut ML, Franke WD, Jackson DA, King DS.

Exercise Biochemistry Laboratory, Department of Health and Human Performance, Iowa State University, Ames, IA, USA.

The effectiveness of a nutritional supplement designed to enhance serum testosterone concentrations and prevent the formation of dihydrotestosterone and estrogens from the ingested androgens was investigated in healthy 30- to 59-year old men. Subjects were randomly assigned to consume DION (300 mg androstenedione, 150 mg dehydroepiandrosterone, 540 mg saw palmetto, 300 mg indole-3-carbinol, 625 mg chrysin, and 750 mg Tribulus terrestris per day; n = 28) or placebo (n = 27) for 28 days. Serum free testosterone, total testosterone, androstenedione, dihydrotestosterone, estradiol, prostate-specific antigen (PSA), and lipid concentrations were measured before and throughout the 4-week supplementation period. Serum concentrations of total testosterone and PSA were unchanged by supplementation. DION increased (p < 0.05) serum androstenedione (342%), free testosterone (38%), dihydrotestosterone (71%), and estradiol (103%) concentrations. Serum HDL-C concentrations were reduced by 5.0 mg/dL in DION (p < 0.05). Increases in serum free testosterone (r2 = 0.01), androstenedione (r2 = 0.01), dihydrotestosterone (r2 = 0.03), or estradiol (r2 = 0.07) concentrations in DION were not related to age. While the ingestion of androstenedione combined with herbal products increased serum free testosterone concentrations in older men, these herbal products did not prevent the conversion of ingested androstenedione to estradiol and dihydrotestosterone.



There are a lot of Euro studies to look at but this one from Iowa State... you remember the place sent to ax andro and did a job of proving how effective and healthy it really is..anyway... we all know we can prevent conversion to E if we want to, and I could care less about DHT. BTW, what do you think andro converts to??? LOL Iowa State is sooo bogus.

Get some science direct or Elservier stuff...

[Sunkist]

Gynaecomastia and the plant product "Tribulis terrestris".

Jameel JK, Kneeshaw PJ, Rao VS, Drew PJ.

Academic Surgical Unit, Castle Hill Hospital, University of Hull, Cottingham, East Yorkshire HU16 5JQ, UK.

Gynaecomastia is the commonest benign breast condition seen in men. It is well recognised that certain drugs that alter the normal sex hormonal profile in the body can induce gynaecomastia. Recently, an increasing use of androgenic-anabolic steroids among young men especially body-builders has increased the incidence of gynaecomastia. We report a case of a young weight-trainer who developed gynaecomastia due to oral intake of a herbal tablet which he used as a steroid alternative for body-building.



I thought this abstract was interesting. I wonder how a male gets the sex hormones to produce gyno if Trib has no effects. As we all know every thing effects us differently as individuals. I can't post the study for obvious reasons.

[feofletch]

I had used trib while waiting for my insur to approve my TRT. It made my day seem brighter and clearer but I don't think it increased my T levels. To increase your T level naturally one of the best things to do is HEAVY SQUATS and then the othe is HEAVY DEAD LIFTS... but not in the smae day. Soy protien is not good for T levels either... stay away from that as well.

[GymJim]

Originally Posted by feofletch

I had used trib while waiting for my insur to approve my TRT. It made my day seem brighter and clearer but I don't think it increased my T levels. To increase your T level naturally one of the best things to do is HEAVY SQUATS and then the othe is HEAVY DEAD LIFTS... but not in the smae day. Soy protien is not good for T levels either... stay away from that as well.

Routine heavy weightlifting exercises in general will help raise your testosterone levels. But the effect of squats and deads specifically on your testosterone levels is vastly exaggerated. You should doo them but doon't expect miracles. And despite the hysteria in some bodybuilding forums, soy protein is fine as part of balanced diet of lean meats and other protein sources. I wouldn't skip meast and only eat soy since I like meat, but if you eat some soy as part of your diet it will not hurt you in any way.

[Vicious cycle]

Is Tribulus Terristris out of the question?
Yes!
Tribulus Terristris = waste of money