without PCT will the normal T level eventually kick in ?

[ciobl]

hello guys:

lets put this scenario as an example

for a normal person with average testosterone levels the use of prohormones inconsistently and not specifically following any cycle but note that with enough time off to recover ( same time on-off and at one point more time off )

a) Is it possible to recover eventually without having to use an anti-estrogen ?

b) Will the natural T be suppressed completely for life unless a proper PCT is administered or the administration of ancillaries is just a cushion to make the transition more smoothly ?

c) No signs such as gyno or hair loss were noticeable.

thank you guys

[Weatherlite]

a) Yes but it will take a damn long time. Anti-E doesn't necessarily help production either. Depends on what you use.

b) T will not be suppressed for life. Suppressed means just that. It doesn't mean that it's been killed permanently.

c) Lucky. Some guys have gyno with even small amount of PH's

[ciobl]

Weatherlite ->

long time like months, right ? but after that a normal person should have the natural testosterone production back, right ?

[Stez]

You should get it all back in time, but some unlucky people don't.

HOWEVER!!! You need testosterone to build AND KEEP muscle, and keep fat down. So even if u gain 15lbs of muscle on prohormones, if u dont get your natural testosterone back quickly to support that muscle then you're gonna lose it all, and probably gain some fat as well.

PCT is the most important part of any aas/prohormone cycle.

[SWALE]

Let's put this discussion of PH's to rest now.

[Weatherlite]

SWALE, I think he's asking because he used PH's in the past and is having symptoms of low test (that or he may be on PH's right now and wants to get off but doesn't want to screw his natural production.)

Either way, I don't think he's asking for advice about a cycle. I feel he wants to see if he screwed up (will screw up if on cycle now) his natural T production and end up on TRT.

ciobl, if I'm off on this let me know.

As far as how long....everyone is different. I've heard of folks having it take months, others years. Some, never.

BTW, SWALE is right...if this is about advice for a cycle it should be addressed in the AAS forum. I didn't think it was though, that's why I responded.

[BigRagu]

he seems like he just wants help with the bodies supression....... i think it's a legit question.......... u could always get on PCT now if u didn't once u got off the cycle....... are u experiencing any side effects......... if i am wrong about replying just let me know....... i don't want to make u mad swale.........

[SWALE]

Well, it sure looks like questions about cycling, AAS and PH use to me.

[ciobl]

Originally Posted by Weatherlite

SWALE, I think he's asking because he used PH's in the past and is having symptoms of low test (that or he may be on PH's right now and wants to get off but doesn't want to screw his natural production.)

Either way, I don't think he's asking for advice about a cycle. I feel he wants to see if he screwed up (will screw up if on cycle now) his natural T production and end up on TRT.

ciobl, if I'm off on this let me know.

As far as how long....everyone is different. I've heard of folks having it take months, others years. Some, never.

BTW, SWALE is right...if this is about advice for a cycle it should be addressed in the AAS forum. I didn't think it was though, that's why I responded.

Dr. Swale just like Weatherlite suspected in the first place, I am not asking for any prohormone advice cycle.

The question is directed towards a proper PCT to recover from the past usage of prohormones.

Now, it would not be wise to think the help I am trying to seek is anywhere related to use of cycles or illegal use of anabolics but to the proper follow up with post cycle therapy that would lead me to have a well feeling overall.

if anybody asks me why i posted it here:

a) What is the purpose of hrt or trt or whatever you want to call it ?
same as the past usage of prohormones that due to ignorance on the topic did not follow up with post cycle therapy. Seeking to feel well, have more energy, increase sexual drive, have more concentration responses, increase libido, etc.

b) Why not post this thread on another forum closely related to prohormones or steroid usage ?
I never did prohormones with the same goal than many bodybuilders did, but as a therapy to what I have believed of being hypogonadal. And since it worked for me and felt extremely well, I stuck with it but I repeat, due to ignorance on my part never took the appropiate steps to fully recover.

I don't think this thread had to fit anywhere else on the board but just on the hrt forum, as I have always felt the past usage of prohormones was part of a self-administered hormone replacement therapy that I watched closely and never, ever abused but like I said, for being ignorant have paid my dues on the process.

Protocol on post cycle therapy by Dr Swale that you can find on any regular text-search engine will come up on different forums throughout the internet and it can not be misinterpreted as an advice to the cycle of illegal substances but a proper follow up, essential part of hormone replacement therapy, or I am wrong ?

thank you, sorry if i bothered anyone.

[SWALE]

ciobl--No bother at all. We just jealously protect this Forum from discussions regarding PH (same thing as AAS) discussions. Often guys come here becuse they want to hear it from a doctor who works in this field.

Fact is, there are many who have come here because they have become permanently hypogonadal after using those substances.

I do treat some patients who have chosen, for the time being, to use steroids. My goal is to try to maintain their health, the best I can, so on the day they finally decide to quit using, they will be in the best state of health possible for the rest of their lives.

Having said all that, the paper I wrote on how to protect yourself better while on, and immediately after (i.e. PCT) steroid use, and have freely provided to all who would heed its advice, would be a good starting point for you. This is exactly the advice you are looking for, I think.

Welcome to the Forum.