Obama for Pres. does this worry anybody?

[porkhide]

Originally Posted by Dionysus

LMFAO

Wow, was this the election of: "Let the Dumbest Man Win..." ???

I'm certainly no fan of Gore/Kerry but "Dubbya" has to be the stupidist leader of all times.

Oh, and P.S., the war in Iraq was not a "war on terror". It was labeled "Operation Iraqi Freedom".
It was to free all of the poor Iraqi's that were being held down by Saddam's oppressive ways...

Hey, with the benifit of hindsight, maybe Saddam knew how to keep control of those people after all... We sure can't.

I still think Gore would have been worse and 9-11 would have still happend
They say the cream rises to the top, but shit floats.

I thought it was a family grudge. Sadam sent a hit squad for Bush one. so dubya went after him

[Dionysus]

Do you really believe baby Bush could actually talk the powers that be into invading a sovereign Nation simply on a grudge?

Hey, whatever helps you sleep at night.

[porkhide]

Originally Posted by Dionysus

Do you really believe baby Bush could actually talk the powers that be into invading a sovereign Nation simply on a grudge?

Hey, whatever helps you sleep at night.

No, I was being Satirical. sorry you took that serious.

But he is causing global warming so he will have beach front property down in texas.

[Dionysus]

Gotcha

[deathgrip07]

A few points:
1) JFK was not 35 when elected, he in fact was 43.
2) Socialism and Fascism are not nearly identical.
3) GWB may not be the best president, but there have been many that were far worse. Hillary, or Obama are not the answer to the problems of the U.S. One has been surrounded by scandal nearly her entire life, and the other just became a Senator two years ago.
4) Historically very few people have made the transition from Senate to the Oval office.
5) I'm tired and going to bed.
I thought the thread was good though. I like to see how people think of the current candidates.

[Grizzly]

Originally Posted by deathgrip07

2) Socialism and Fascism are not nearly identical.
.

Are they not? In both cases, the government owns the means of production; appropriates it to the State and the "common good".

[deathgrip07]

We're both right in a certain sense... I'll give you some examples and maybe you will see my point of view a little better.

1)There are no true Socialist nations currently; although Chavez is trying to disguise Fascism as Socialism in Venezuela. Mark my words... he is a fascist dictator, that country and it's people will suffer dearly.
----Pretty much all of Western Europe fall under the Socialism category. High taxes, extensive social programs such as Universal Healthcare, huge welfare payroll, ultra high and numerous taxes, ridiculously high unemployment rates (most are over 10%), etc, etc, etc...

2) Nazi Germany was Fascism. Italy under Mussolini was Fascism. These people who call GWB a Fascist and complain about the US falling into Fascism, don't know what it even is.

3) Communism = a failed ideology. Ask the former Soviet Union, Cuba, Vietnam, North Korea, and a few other nations how Communism is working for them. People who argue in favor of this ideology or some resemblance thereof should be immediately be slapped in the chops.

If say a candidate such as Hillary or Obama gets elected to the presidency in the US, the slide into a Western Europe style Socialism starts. Implementation of higher taxes, more social programs, Universal healthcare (which will be horrible), and more Government poking around in private business will drag us into the shitter. The same people who complain perennially about how bad the US goverment is; are the same people who argue for more Government action and interference... there's a disconnect there. They don't think the Government is competent at anything, but they want Universal Healthcare (which is controlled by the Government!). The framers of the Constitution would roll over in their graves, for these are the reasons they left Europe in the first place. There is a huge lack of personal responsibility in this country today. Everyone's always looking for goodies, but don't want to pay for them.

[Dionysus]

Originally Posted by deathgrip07

They don't think the Government is competent at anything, but they want Universal Healthcare (which is controlled by the Government!). The framers of the Constitution would roll over in their graves, for these are the reasons they left Europe in the first place. There is a huge lack of personal responsibility in this country today. Everyone's always looking for goodies, but don't want to pay for them.

The strange thing here, deathgrip, is that I have family in Germany that receive free excellent health care, free University, 1/3 or more of their salary for maturnity leave, plus more...

(On Tuesday, German government ministers agreed to revamp support for new
parents, including a clause that rewards fathers who agree to stay home. Under
the agreement, either parent will be able to take a leave from their job for up
to one year and receive 67 percent of their wages up to $2,250 a month.)

And funny, they can't believe the hoops we have to jump through here in the US, where some 46 million Americans can't afford health insurance!

I'm not exactly disagreeing with you, but just dont piss on my head and tell me its raining.

I just think the federal government, burdened with all of its corruption and dead wood, would fail miserably at any attempt to socialize anything.

[Dionysus]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parental_leave

Look at the vast difference between the US and say, Sweden or Norway, two "Socialist" countries.

I'm not defending Socialism, as realize it has its inherent problems. But lets not be brainwashed into thinking we've got it so great here in the States either.

P.S. Sweden's unemployment rate is 4.6%.
Norway's unemployment rate 3.5%

United States unemployment rate 5.1%

[deathgrip07]

Dionysius... No intention of pissing on your head, but while Germany's healthcare is good, it is not free, neither is their University, the German people pay for it with higher taxes. Not that we in the US aren't paying high taxes either.

As for the Unemployment rates in Europe... All I can say is look them up on a reliable resource. I use WorldFactbook. Historically it has been pretty reliable. Norway is a far better example of a successful nation with Socialist values, although it's pop is under 5,000,000. New York City has more people with 8 million.

And I definitely agree that the US would fail at an attempt to socialize anything in any serious manner.

[Grizzly]

Originally Posted by deathgrip07

We're both right in a certain sense... I'll give you some examples and maybe you will see my point of view a little better. .

No, not really. I can't figure out WTF you're talking about.

[Bigkarch]

Obama is actually the third cousin to Bin Laden....dont vote for him..

[jmills]

I wish Colin Powell would run...

[prodigy06]

Originally Posted by eleven11

Am I the only one who thinks this is a very bad idea, and dont say he couldn't win, the dems will vote for anyone in there party.
I have my reasons for saying this. but one thing he's only 42? and dont give me the race card I would vote for anyone I thought was best for the job but it aint in this party. this is not a time in history to be fucking around with PC...............................11

Maybe you would vote for anyone who you think is best for the job regradless of race and religion but you're in the minority. Trust me.
I'm willing to bet anyone 5 bottles of Test E and a hand job that this guy will NOT win.
Any takers?

[bigcountry76]

HELL NO!!! i don't think he will win.. there was so talk about talking guns away. I know the former Mayor of NY city Ruby Gilliania is running Rep. he is big gun control guy. I keep hearing about all the shit about Arnold running for president. i didn't say he wouldn't be a goodd president but he can't run for president. i guess some people should have paid more attention in social studies class.

The reason is Article II of the United States Constitution which reads, "No person except a natural-born citizen . . . shall be eligible to the Office of President.''

It's in there because John Jay, the presiding officer of the Constitutional Convention, wrote a letter to George Washington in 1787 arguing that the commander-in-chief of the United States Army should not be anyone but a natural-born American. The Founders were worried about ambitious foreigners taking over the country; as in Poland, which -- at the time -- had just been partitioned between Austria, Prussia and Russia.