How to not fuck up DNP

[Peace Division]

Wolf, I totally respect what you are saying about possible repro damage by DNP. But if you look up an MSDS for testosterone, it'll tell you that it is a listed carcinogen by OSHA and other organizations.

I understand that DNP is a man-made chemical and that test is a "natural" chemical, but both chemicals, when abused, will cause long terms problems. When used sensibly, it may be worth the risk for people. Just my 2 cc's. Peace.

[cvguy]

2TheTop for a great posting. Will be starting a cycle today.

[Heretic]

I've had some questions about this lately, so I'm bumping it back up.
Regards,
-H-

[stabmaster]

Of the limited information available on DNP that I've been able to locate, there are always suggestions that one should be taking antioxidants to offset the increased incidence of free radicals from the process. I also noticed that the suggestions for antioxidants were fairly random. Since the only long term/irreversable side effects from DNP are probably caused by free radicals, I found it curious that the antioxident regimen was somewhat pedantic.

For curiosity alone, I dug around to find what could be a targeted antioxident regimen for a DNP cycle. Here's what I came up with:

I.
In the early 1900's, with the absence of any set procedures in taking DNP, there was a 1% incidence of cataracts over a large population (over 100,000).
http://board1.mantisforums.com/uploa...?threadid=6871

Scientists have determined that the carotenoids lutein and zeaxanthin accumulate in the eyes, specifically in the lens and the macula (the area on the retina responsible for distinguishing fine details). This led them to speculate that people who consume a diet rich in these carotenoids may be less likely to develop cataracts or macular degeneration. http://www.healthandage.com/Home/gm=6!gid2=997

Carotenoids-
Astaxanthin
Canthaxanthin
Lutein
Zeaxanthin
beta-carotein
lycopene

apparently, Astaxanthin is slightly stronger than any of the rest (no reference)

II.
For some reason DNP use can cause a histamine build-up in the body, which means a rash/hives. This may not happen your first cycle, but if you use a lot or do not take enough time off inbetween for your body to process the remaining DNP, you may encounter this. [go to page 1, you'll find this ]

OPCs (oligomeric proanthrocyanidin complexes) reduce the release and production of pro-inflammatory histamine

OPCs:
grape seed extract (mostly procyanidins)
grape skin (anthocyanidins)
pine bark
camellia sinensis (found in green tea)
OPCs found in: hawthorn flowers, berries, onions, peas, parsley
related componds found in: bilberry, cranberry, uva ursi, coffee, chocolate, peanut skins

http://www.mcp.edu/herbal/opcs/opcs.pdf

III.
DNP accomplishes the astounding boost in metabolic rate via inhibition of the F0F1 ATP synthase molecule, located in the inner wall of each mitochondrion. http://board1.mantisforums.com/uploa...?threadid=6871

In order to burn fats and carbohydrates to make metabolic fuel, mitochondria take electrons from oxygen and shuffle them among a suite of molecules in a complex chain reaction. Invariably, some of the electrons get misplaced, creating free radicals. "People have estimated that [the electron transport chain] is maybe 98 percent efficient, which is much better than a human engineer can do," says Ames. "But it still makes kilos of oxygen radicals per person per year."
Mitochondria produce more oxidants than any other single site in a cell, the main offenders being superoxide, hydrogen peroxide, and hydroxyl radicals. Ames thought mitochondria would therefore be hardest hit by free-radical damage, not only to mitochondrial DNA but also to enzymes in the electron transport chain and lipids in mitochondrial membranes.
It also occurred to him that mitochondria might be an ideal target for intervening in the aging process...

...Acetyl-L-carnitine, also known as Alcar, is a nutrient that helps transport fatty-acid fuel across lipid membranes into mitochondria. Thus the more Alcar a cell has, the better its mitochondria might function.
Ames reasoned that high levels of Alcar might also combat the problems of aging membranes and decrepit enzymes. He began feeding Alcar to his old rats. Within weeks, he and Hagen noticed improvements in the animals' biochemistry and behavior. Their mitochondria were going full bore again, and they had become far more active. But the old rats were still churning out oxidants at a very high rate. In fact, by goosing metabolism, Alcar seemed to slightly increase free-radical production. "We didn't solve the problem of oxidants," Ames says. "In fact, if anything, it was a little worse."
Ames decided to add an agent to the rats' diet to neutralize the oxidants. He tried lipoic acid, a mitochondrial antioxidant. The results were profound. Oxidants and oxidative damage to mitochondrial components dropped dramatically. Both the structure and function of the mitochondria improved. The rats' activity levels doubled. They were, Ames says, "doing the Macarena." The combination of the nutrient and the antioxidant had a synergistic effect. "The two together are better than either one alone." http://www.discover.com/oct_02/featradical.html

Mitochondria targeting antioxidants:
ALCAR
Lipoic Acid

Also, COQ10 is a myocardial mitochondria free radical scavenger, which is probably not a bad antioxidant to consider on DNP.

I am just curious to see if people think that this might be a good approach to choosing antioxidants on a DNP cycle. I really don't know much about antioxidants- this post was basically a half an hour worth of googleing. And sorry that most of the sources are not "primary sources," I am just throwing out ideas here.

The next important factors would be:
Price
Dosing
Strength/Bioavailability
Synergism/interactions
Tissue specificity
..and I'm probably missing a lot here.. I thought this could be a start, though.

[cvguy]

Excellent comments, StabMaster

[crewboss]

Originally Posted by cvguy

Excellent comments, StabMaster

bump

[Peace Division]

Nice to see this made it to the sticky section. This will help keep a lotta people safe. Thanks.

[pot-bellied-stallion]

Originally Posted by Peace Division

Nice to see this made it to the sticky section. This will help keep a lotta people safe. Thanks.

lot of good info

[HammyAbeer]

For my upcoming DNP cycle I am buying Phyto Foods by Now which covers many anti-oxidant bases, and I will stack that with R-ALA, Vit C,B,E.

THat should cover me fairly well.


Diet is still undecided....

-H- and others, what diet in your experience has produced the best results?

[FyRchick]

Just curious... Do you know how DNP affects women? I'm just researching around right now. I know its a very dangerous, strong substance, and most females are discouraged from even doing winny, so I was thinking this would probably be dangerous as well?

[Bob Smith]

One of the articles posted earlier in this thread probably covers it. Something about the possibility of it being stored in ovum. Whether its true or not, I would say its best to stay on the safe side. Some guys girlfriends *cough, cough* wont swallow like usual when the guy is on dnp.

[FyRchick]

Originally Posted by Bob Smith

One of the articles posted earlier in this thread probably covers it. Something about the possibility of it being stored in ovum. Whether its true or not, I would say its best to stay on the safe side. Some guys girlfriends *cough, cough* wont swallow like usual when the guy is on dnp.

LMAO! uh ohhhh... He'll be lying in a puddle of sweat anyway...doubt he'll want her to!

[FyRchick]

Quick question. If carb/fats are metabolized for energy rather than ATP, how can active transport continue? Without the breakdown of ATP to ADP+ Phosphate, the sodium/potassium exchanges are halted and osmotic balance cannot continue. Therefore, action potentials cannot be generated correct? I don't see how carb/fats can maintain a liveable homeostasis within our bodies. Am I way off?

[Heretic]

I think both of those posts are covered in the info posted earlier, I know the post by Animal deals with the question of how energy production can still be continued.
Regards,
-H-

[hailtopitt]

FyRchick, actually, they way it works is...the ATPase protein that makes ATP is like a pump that requires a proton gradient to drive itself. For every few protons that are pumped through, ADP and an inorganic phosphate molecule get converted to ATP, which drives bodily processes, homeostasis, etc... the way DNP works is by decreasing the proton gradient, thereby decreasing ATP levels. Obviously your body is going to look for another source of ATP, such as glycolysis, TCA, etc... when glycolysis occurs, stored glycogen/fat is broken down and used as the source of ATP to drive basic life functions. as you probably know, during normal exercise, once your body depletes stored muscle glycogen and starts using glycolysis as its energy source, your body temp goes up, you start to sweat, and you start to breath heavier in order to remove the excess CO2 that is produced as a bi-product of the process...sound familiar? all of the "side effects" of DNP. this is also why some people recommend carb depleting for 2 days before staring a cycle of DNP. by depleting the stored muscle glycogen before the first dose, the DNP can work right away.
but this is where the danger of DNP use comes from...if enough ATP cannot be produced by the pathways mentioned above, then theoretically your body would run out of ATP, and all bodily functions would cease, i.e. cardiac, brain, lungs, etc... if you do some searching, in studies where rats were overdosed with DNP, rigor mortis set in immediately. Rigor mortis occurs in dead animals when ATP levels are depleted from muscle to the point where the muscle contracts and cannot be relaxed. this makes sense based on the actions of DNP.
i would never recommend that a female use DNP. DNP gets into every cell in your body, including the ovaries, eggs, testes, and sperm. for males, it's not a big deal b/c we're making a fresh supply every day. for females, however, your egg numbers are set and you're carrying them all with you right now. the risk vs. benefit is not worth it...DNP won't do anything that exercise can't.
hope this helps.