MESO-Rx

Steroid Forum: This is a discussion on Test only cycles not a good idea within the Anabolic Steroids forums, part of the extensive steroid information at MESO-Rx; Good read about tendons. While injecting test increases protein synthesis by roughly 50 times, depending on dose and time, most ...

Go Back   MESO-Rx > Anabolic Steroids > Steroid Forum
Connect with Facebook

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 08-19-2004, 04:02 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 326
Rep Power: 0
roadkill is on a distinguished road
Default Test only cycles not a good idea

Good read about tendons.

While injecting test increases protein synthesis by roughly 50 times, depending on dose and time, most bodybuilders forget that it will reduce collagen synthesis by more than 50% -- more like 80%, giving you the collagen synthesis rate of a senior citizen. Since collagen makes up tendons, bros are very prone to injury if they continue to lift very heavy, unless they cycle off T and let their collagen synthesis get back to normal. It's like having the skeletal muscle of a gorilla with the tendons of a very old man.

Winstrol increases collagen synthesis. It will give you bigger tendons. However, your body compensates for this by making them more brittle, weaker, and more prone to injury. I can't tell you how many bros work out anaerobically and become injured while on winstrol. Guys who lift in the 1-5 rep range while on winstrol, to baseball players who sprint all out from a stationary position -- winstrol should be the LAST drug they choose. Most of them like winstrol because they don't get the weight gain from it but it is very detrimental to bros who train for any sport anaerobically. Tendons tear easily on it.

Also, the drugs I mention increase collagen synthesis while also increasing collagen cross-linking integrity, making for a much stronger tendon.

Winstrol, on the other hand, will dramatically increase collagen syn, but ironically it decreases collagen cross-linking integrity, thus making a much weaker tendon.

You can plan a cycle of AAS which will increase collagen synthesis and skeletal muscle growth at the same time. The key is the drug(s) you choose.

Deca, Equipoise, Anavar, and Primobolan will ALL increase skeletal muscle while at the same time dramatically increase collagen syn and bone mass and density, leaving you with a substantially reduced chance of becoming injured than if you choose to use AAS like sus, cyp, or enth.

While testosterone will increase bone mass and density, even at supra-physiological levels, the result is weaker tendons due to inhibition of collagen syn.

To plan a cycle where the goal is to increase skeletal muscle mass/strength while at the same time increase joint/tendon/ligament strength, enough to keep up with the dramatic increase in skeletal muscle, you must choose drugs like Eq, Deca, Anavar, or Primo as the base of your cycle. Testosterone and its esters can be added to your cycle to keep levels within a 'normal' physiological range (ie, 100-200 mg/wk) but must not go above this. Since drugs like eq, deca, anavar and primo will reduce endogenous, natural levels of test, these levels may be maintained with exogenous test in the 100-200 mg/wk range. Test at this dose will not inhibit collagen syn, but paradoxically, will help increase it. It is when exogenous testosterone is used > 200 mg/wk that collagen syn is inhibited.

Deca @ 3 mg/kg a week(about 270 mg/wk for a 200 lb male) will increase procollagen III levels by 270% by week 2. Procollagen III is a primary indicator used to determine the rate of collagen syn. As you can see, deca is a very good drug at giving you everything you want -- an increase in collagen syn, an increase in skeletal muscle, and increases in bone mass and density. The one thing it does not give you is wood

Primobolan, @ 5 mg/kg, will increase collagen synthesis by roughly 180% -- less than deca and equipoise but still substantial.

Equipoise @ 3 mg/kg will increase procollagen III by approximately 340% -- slightly better than deca.

Oxandrolone has over a hundred studies documenting its effectiveness at treating patients needing rapid increases in collagen syn to enhance healing.

These drugs have longer half-lives than most other AAS, so this should be considered when timing your post cycle clomid use. Here they are:

Deca: 15 days Equipoise: 14 days Primobolan: 10.5 days

Anavar has a half-life of only 8 hours so it should not pose a problem.

GH is probably the most remarkable drug at increasing collagen synthesis. It increases collagen syn in a dose dependant manner -- the more you use, the more you will increase collagen syn. It has also demonstrated this ability in short and long term studies. From what I've read, hGH at 6 iu/day increased the collagen deposition rate by around 250% in damaged collagen structures. This result indicates that the increased biomechanical strength of wounds to collagen structures treated with biosynthetic human growth hormone was produced by an increased deposition of collagen in the collagen structures.

Eq, primo, anavar, and deca are all good -- they increase several biomakers of collagen syn -- ie, type III, II, I, procollagen markers. GH just seems to do so most dramatically.

Use of any of these drugs @ supra-physiological levels with a maintenance dose of test will increase collagen syn while at the same time increase skeletal muscle mass. Skeletal muscle mass gains will not be as dramatic as with large testosterone doses but you have to weigh the risk/reward basis for yourself. Also, these drugs do not satisfy the libido like testosterone, but that is not the point of this thread. It is only to demonstrate that you can increase skeletal muscle and collagen syn at the same time with certain AAS, the decision is up to you.
Twitter
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 08-19-2004, 05:19 PM
MJM's Avatar
MJM MJM is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 822
Rep Power: 0
MJM is an unknown quantity at this point
Default

Good post, that's why I'm doing 250 MG/WK of test then my other stuff.I use HCG to keep my nuts good size still.I injured my shoulder my last cycle.
Twitter
Reply With Quote


Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 08-19-2004, 05:23 PM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 2
Rep Power: 0
yankees2004 is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MJM
Good post, that's why I'm doing 250 MG/WK of test then my other stuff.I use HCG to keep my nuts good size still.I injured my shoulder my last cycle.

jesus! this guy posts on every thread!!! he has to be the most irritating member on this board. i can feel my blood pressure increase by 20 points after reading his replys!
Twitter
Reply With Quote


Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
Sponsored Links
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 08-19-2004, 05:42 PM
MJM's Avatar
MJM MJM is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 822
Rep Power: 0
MJM is an unknown quantity at this point
Default

Post something worth while on here in the anabolic section.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yankees2004
jesus! this guy posts on every thread!!! he has to be the most irritating member on this board. i can feel my blood pressure increase by 20 points after reading his replys!
Twitter
Reply With Quote


Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 08-19-2004, 05:44 PM
esco's Avatar
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: USA
Posts: 1,882
Rep Power: 0
esco is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MJM
Post something worth while on here in the anabolic section.

follow your own advice mjm! you have not contributed sh*t since day 1!
Twitter
Reply With Quote


Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 08-19-2004, 05:48 PM
MJM's Avatar
MJM MJM is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 822
Rep Power: 0
MJM is an unknown quantity at this point
Default

I'm not giving advice.I'm commenting on this.No need to hijack this informative thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by esco
follow your own advice mjm! you have not contributed sh*t since day 1!
Twitter
Reply With Quote


Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 08-19-2004, 06:18 PM
Quasimoto's Avatar
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,208
Rep Power: 0
Quasimoto is an unknown quantity at this point
Default

Good read, something to think about huh ? Thanks.
Twitter
Reply With Quote


Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 08-19-2004, 06:36 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 83
Rep Power: 0
incrediblehulk is on a distinguished road
Default

i was going to do a 750mg frontload and then 500mg a week of test enth for about 8 weeks. Should i now add some deca say at 200mg a week just to kep the strenght up??
Twitter
Reply With Quote


Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 08-19-2004, 08:00 PM
einstein1905's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 858
Rep Power: 0
einstein1905 is an unknown quantity at this point
Default

Those numbers are in vitro data. It neglects to account for the increase in GH due to increased testosterone levels, which increases all forms of collagen synthesis and contributes to stronger tendons/ligaments
Twitter
Reply With Quote


Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 08-19-2004, 08:19 PM
madman's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Did somebody take my picture?
Posts: 663
Rep Power: 0
madman is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by einstein1905
Those numbers are in vitro data. It neglects to account for the increase in GH due to increased testosterone levels, which increases all forms of collagen synthesis and contributes to stronger tendons/ligaments
einstein1905 wins again! Smart fucker!
Twitter
Reply With Quote


Did you find this post helpful? Yes | No
Reply

Tags
aas , anabolic , anadrol , anavar , baseball , bodybuilders , clomid , cycle , dbol , deca , equipoise , growth , growth hormone , hcg , hgh , human growth hormone , injecting , libido , primobolan , protein , testosterone , tren

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:36 AM.


Advertising on Steroids



1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12