Question for the all knowledgeable ones (Hogg, AM, JS, and so forth)

[Grizzly]

With the chins and BB rows, you should be stressing the bis enough. Give them a rest for 10 weeks. It won't kill you and they won't magically disappear. I'd also leave the lateral raises out, too. Try it this way and see what happens.

[Freddy]

Grizz is right.

But since you'll probably go nuts if you don't curl, like most Americans...do 2 sets of curls on A days.

EDIT: Do NOT add in shoulder raises or any more shoulder work. The program has tons of direct and indirect shoulder work as is...it can't handle any more, trust me.

You will get "definition" from burning calories from doing those cleans. They're difficult lifts.

[strengthcoach]

Im just wondering why speed-strenght lifts are being done last in the workout?

4 weeks are spent at 3x5....then a slight decline in volume 2x3. There is very little change in the overal volume, and your using an outdated system of periodization.

The alteration in training volume is too narrow, and a larger variation would create greater adaptation.

As for the frequency issue, if you go back to the works of K. Hakkenen you will see that the higher the frequency of training, at the same volume, the greater the result.

Just some things you may want to think about.

Strengthcoach

[Freddy]

Originally Posted by strengthcoach

Im just wondering why speed-strenght lifts are being done last in the workout?

You can pull heavy after pressing, many good programs do this. One incarnation of Bill Starr's 5x5 has powercleaning performed after some pressing movements. WSB has back work performed after pressing too (in the form of rows usually).

If we were talking about an athlete whose real concern was developing better speed, than I totatlly agree, it might be ideal to do them first. However, keep in mind that he is a recreational bodybuilder...for purposes of weight gain, I don't think you can argue this won't work.

Originally Posted by strengthcoach

4 weeks are spent at 3x5....then a slight decline in volume 2x3. There is very little change in the overal volume, and your using an outdated system of periodization.

This is a dual factor program, and its not linear periodization. The difficulty increases, dips down, and then increases again towards a peak. This is different than normal linear periodized programs, which cannot guage difficulty quantitatively.

This is still used by a lot of successful clubs.

Originally Posted by strengthcoach

The alteration in training volume is too narrow, and a larger variation would create greater adaptation.

Maybe...but I don't think so. I think you forgot that frequency declines at the same time as daily volume...so weekly volume is drastically lowered. You're doing as little as 2 sets a week in place of 6...thats a 1/3 of the volume. Thats pretty drastic.

Originally Posted by strengthcoach

As for the frequency issue, if you go back to the works of K. Hakkenen you will see that the higher the frequency of training, at the same volume, the greater the result.

Just some things you may want to think about.

Strengthcoach

It begins with fairly high frequency, especially for someone new to this type of training, which remember...this athlete is. Granted, its no where near the amount of frequency that elite strength athletes are using...with 14-32 workouts per week...but remember, we're not talking about an Alexiev, a Chuck V, a Steve Goggins, or a Tavakoli.