Training program - advice would be great !

[steverae]

Hello, some of you will remember me from the other forum (Anabolic). Since all the posts i received there, thought i'd take your advice and do things naturally....

Here is my training / cardio program, i spend around 5 minutes on the rowing machine to warm up before each session.
Dumbell weights are per dumbell

Monday

Chest 1 :-
4 x flat dumbell press x 10 supersetted with x 30 flat dumbell flye
4 x Smith machine flat barbell Press x 10
4 x Smith machine incline barbell press x 10
Finish off with ab work for 10 minutes

Tuesday

Shoulder - biceps :-
4 x barbell shoulder press x 10
4 x dumbell shoulder press x 10
4 x smith machine shoulder press x 10
4 x Shoulder Shrug x 20
4 x concentration curl x 10 per arm
4 x preacher curl x 10 per arm

Thursday

Chest 2 :-
4 x decline dumbell press x 10 supersetted with x 30 flat dumbell flye
4 x Smith machine flat barbell Press x 10
4 x Smith machine incline barbell press x 10
Finish off with ab work for 10 minutes

Friday

Shoulders - Triceps
4 x barbell shoulder press x 10
4 x dumbell shoulder press x 10
4 x smith machine shoulder press x 10
4 x Shoulder Shrug x 20
4 x Tricep pulldown x 10
4 x Tricep reverse curl x 10
4 x Tricep pushdown x 10

I try and do cardio 3 times a week either first thing in the morning or during my lunch break at work (in the work gym) for an hour including warm up and cool down which includes the rowing machine, cycle and cross trainer.( the skiing thing)

I also try and do slow pushups and crunches at home when i get the chance at least 3 times a week.

As for diet, i try to avoid fastfood and takeaways as much as possible and eat Baked patato's, pasta, brown bread and pasta as much as possible. I also take Whey protein shakes with breakfast and after training or with evening meal.

I try to keep to this pattern as much as possible but what with work and 1 2 and half year old and another baby on the way (the wife, not me) it's sometimes hard to eat at the right times.

Now for some stats :

Age 34
Weight 176lbs
height 5'6"
upper arms 15.5"
chest 40"
Waist 35"

I don't look particularly overweight, which i think is good, dunno where all the weight is...?I've been told that i am a good size to put on muscle as my arms etc are not very long compared to a person of say 6 foot

I have been training since end of february 05 and have notices a huge difference since i started, especially around my belly, which has got the indents either side of the ab muscles back !!!

My ultimate goal is to increase my chest, shoulder and arm size...

One final point is that i steadily increase the weight i have been lifting over the months, example,, flat dumbell press atarted at 15kg, now at 27.5kg !!

I know that lifting heavy is the way to go... but any help would be great....oh one final thing, i try to keep myu weight training to no more than 50 minutes a session, including my 5 minute warm up.

[Gavin Laird]

Train your legs.

[steverae]

Originally Posted by Gavin Laird

Train your legs.

Hi, i thought about my legs but they are fairly strong anyway from years of karate. I only really need to improve my upper body, what benefit would i get from training legs ? i do know that they are one of the largeset muscle groups so would burn more calories during a workout, where would you suggest i intergrate a leg workout into my training plan. Baring in mind that alot of my cardio work is leg based, would this cause me to gain more muscle on my upper body (that after all is my goal)

[johnsmith182]

i hesitate to even respond to you. nothing personal, honest. its just that ive seen it before, SO MANY TIMES.

if gaining 20lbs involved totally changing what you are doing, putting all the things you think you know about training aside, would you still be willing to do it?

if so, id be willing to try to help you accomplish your goals. but if your really tied into what you are doing now, and resistant to change, then honestly ive got too much on my plate already to worry about it.

i dont mean to come across as an asshole. on the one hand i still get frustrated when i see someone doing things that i know are practically guaranteed to fail, but on the other hand, i a dont want the added frustration of trying to help someone who doesnt really want it.

[Gavin Laird]

Hey JS,

Things you'll never hear from these guys...

"I only wanna train legs. I don't wanna do upper body cause my pecs and delts are pretty big from years of balancing my body above beautiful women."

Oh, no. But plenty guys have legs that are "big / strong enough already".

"Gee this gyms pretty cold, I guess I'll train in a sweater"

But I see plenty little shivering orphans in string vests in December.

"Gee this gyms way too hot, I guess I'll train in my SHORTS!"

But they never need an excuse to take their shirts off.

Etc etc.


Anyway........

Steverae,

I will paste your program down. Everything that is extraneous I will mark with a *, ok?

Monday

Chest 1 :-
4 x flat dumbell press x 10
supersetted with x 30 flat dumbell flye *
4 x Smith machine flat barbell Press x 10 *
4 x Smith machine incline barbell press x 10 *
Finish off with ab work for 10 minutes

Tuesday

Shoulder - biceps :-
4 x barbell shoulder press x 10
4 x dumbell shoulder press x 10*
4 x smith machine shoulder press x 10*
4 x Shoulder Shrug x 20
4 x concentration curl x 10 per arm*
4 x preacher curl x 10 per arm*

Thursday

Chest 2 :-
4 x decline dumbell press x 10 supersetted with x 30 flat dumbell flye*
4 x Smith machine flat barbell Press x 10*
4 x Smith machine incline barbell press x 10*
Finish off with ab work for 10 minutes

Friday

Shoulders - Triceps
4 x barbell shoulder press x 10
4 x dumbell shoulder press x 10*
4 x smith machine shoulder press x 10*
4 x Shoulder Shrug x 20
4 x Tricep pulldown x 10*
4 x Tricep reverse curl x 10*
4 x Tricep pushdown x 10*

I try and do cardio 3 times a week either first thing in the morning or during my lunch break at work (in the work gym) for an hour including warm up and cool down which includes the rowing machine, cycle and cross trainer.( the skiing thing)

I also try and do slow pushups and crunches at home when i get the chance at least 3 times a week.*



So, the worthwhile things you are doing amount to

Bench
Military press
Shrugs
Ab work

Cardio a few times a week.

To this you need to add...

Squats
Chins
Rows
Deadlifts or some other pull
Glute ham raises or some other hamstring work if your pull isn't a clean pull or "Romanian" deadlift.
Some kind of calve training.

Now split the work over 3 days a week, training your whole body each time but emphasising the poundage on either pulling + rowing, squatting, or pressing on a given day. Do 3-5 sets of each movement, for 5-10 reps each. If you must throw in a set of arm work or two here or there. Try to get as strong as possible on these "basic" movements. To give you an idea of what strong is a 60Kg bench is strong...if you are a lightly built 14 year old girl.
Now control your bodyfat by restricting calories, sticking to mostly lean meats and vegetables for most meals. If you need to gain weight, add carbs from oatmeal and brown rice, pasta / potatoes etc.

There "can" be a lot more to it than that, but really there need'nt be. Read the 5 x 5 sticky and thew Hogg "what not to do for beginers" sticky for more info.

Cheers,

G.

[steverae]

okay, i guess that my routine is pants.... i've been doing this for a few months now

This is where you need you guys to guide us beginners on the road to muscle mass-ness...

if gaining 20lbs involved totally changing what you are doing, putting all the things you think you know about training aside, would you still be willing to do it?

if so, id be willing to try to help you accomplish your goals

Help me !!!!! I am willing to change everything i've been doing to get stuff right.....

To this you need to add...

Squats
Chins
Rows
Deadlifts or some other pull
Glute ham raises or some other hamstring work if your pull isn't a clean pull or "Romanian" deadlift.
Some kind of calve training.

Now split the work over 3 days a week, training your whole body each time but emphasising the poundage on either pulling + rowing, squatting, or pressing on a given day. Do 3-5 sets of each movement, for 5-10 reps each. If you must throw in a set of arm work or two here or there. Try to get as strong as possible on these "basic" movements. To give you an idea of what strong is a 60Kg bench is strong...if you are a lightly built 14 year old girl.
Now control your bodyfat by restricting calories, sticking to mostly lean meats and vegetables for most meals. If you need to gain weight, add carbs from oatmeal and brown rice, pasta / potatoes etc.

I'll take on board your advise, you are saying train all the muscle groups 3 times a week.... i've read that somewhere before as well, thought you had to leave enought time for recovery but 48 hours is enough....

help greatly appreciated, awaiting your response JS.

[steverae]

Do a short warmup set before each exercise with approximately 50% of the weight you will use for the main working set. Do about 4 - 6 reps with this lighter weight, just enough to get warmed up.

* Squats 1 X 8 - 10 reps
* Leg Extensions 1 X 8 - 10 reps
* Leg Curls 1 X 8 - 10 reps
* Dumbbell Pullovers 1 X 8 - 10 reps
* Barbell Overhead Shoulder Press 1 X 8 - 10 reps
* Seated Rows 1 X 8 - 10 reps
* Bench Press 1 X 8 - 10 reps
* Barbell Bicep Curls 1 X 8 - 10 reps
* Tricep Extensions 1 X 8 - 10 reps
* Weighted Pullups 1 X 8 - 10 reps
* Weighted Dips 1 X 8 - 10 reps
* Standing Calf Raises 1 X 8 - 12 reps
* Abs - 1 X 10 - 15 reps

This routine is done 3 times a week on a monday, wednesday and friday with no weight training at all on the rest days.

Any good or would you guys recommend i attempt the 5x5 program instead.

Cheers in advance.

[johnsmith182]

monday

squats. warm up properly, then 5 sets of 5 all with the same weight. pick this weight conservatively, and add 5lbs every monday as long as you got all your reps.

bench press. same as squats. again, be conservative at first on weight.

barbell rows. same as squats. dont stand halfway up when doing these. keep your back parrallel to the ground.


wednesday

military press. same thing, but just do 3 sets of 5

chin- ups. do 3 sets to failure, untill you can get 10 reps... when you can get 10 reps on all 3 sets, start adding weight. you should be able to figure out how to do that.

light squats. 3 sets of 5 with a weight that is about 20% lighter than mondays weight.

friday

squats. do one set of five with 10lbs more than you used for all 5 sets of mondays workout. warm up properly.

incline bench press. same as bench press

pick whatever your favorite back exercise is. could be dumbell rows. even lat pulldowns. if you like barbell rows, do them again. could be something else if its reasonable. pick one thing and stick to it. do it for 5 sets, be creative and choose your own rep number. do something you like. but then do 5 sets of that number of reps, all with the same weight. progress just like everything else. start conservatively. add weight each week.

this is a good beginners program for what you want. there are, however, a number of ways to screw it up.

warming up properly is, even though you might not believe me, critical. having good form on the exercises and doing them right is critical.

you ought to buy the book starting strength. it will teach you how to warm up right, how to set things up. how to do the basic exercises. i dont get any money from the sale of this book. i just think it would be a good investment for you.

[morepain]

i don't get around here much anymore, but listen to what Gavin and Johnsmith are telling you.
Step 1 - drop teh bullshit exercises
Step 2 - emphasize compound movements that allow the body to work as a system
Step 3 - every time you think you need to do a set of leg extensions instead of a set of squats, slap yourself and come back to what they are saying.

Seriously these are not just two guys on the board, you are priveledged just to have them taking the time to answer the thread, at least do yourself a favor and try to follow their advice.

[steverae]

Johnsmith182 - THANK YOU.... I really appreciate your input. I WILL take your advice......

every time you think you need to do a set of leg extensions instead of a set of squats, slap yourself and come back to what they are saying.

Sorry but that was really funny, The advice here is second to none.....

Seriously these are not just two guys on the board, you are priveledged just to have them taking the time to answer the thread, at least do yourself a favor and try to follow their advice.

I only hope i can make em proud..... it will take along time, i'm going to cut down my gym sessions to 3 times a week, monday, wednesday and friday and use johnsmith182's advice and work with his program, KEEP THE BASICS and stop trying to be clever by reading Muscle+Fitness or FLEX...

i'll be in touch !

[morepain]

excellent! you have made an intelligent decision that many including myself took years to figure out, congrats and don't forget to eat to power your workouts and gains, good luck.

[steverae]

Hi Guys, It's been a while since i've been on here, having spent alot of time in he gym and with the fammily, i thought i'd get back on here and post some updates for you guys.

Please see this link

http://forum.mesomorphosis.com/photo...ser=14189&sl=s

This is a picture of me taken the other week, I need some advice on how to bulk up my chest more, been working on the 5x5 program which is excellent and has made the improvements in my arms and shoulders.... been bulking at the same time (you can see the double chin) but i'm prettty impressed...

What do you guys think ?

[ricknash]

gavin u said sum stupid shit.
i no buddies that purely train their legs, well not purely, but do all diff mass and strength leg building excerseize for their whole legs like 80% time while doing upper body very rarely.
i also work out in a sweater most of the time, i hate guys who whear muscle shirts and shit

to the poster
lots of ur excersized are shit man
doing too much for sum shit and uses smith machine, why not just use freeweights solely.

[steverae]

Hi Guys, just a quick note to say "5x5 programme is the dogs danglies"

Been on this for a few month now and seem to have grown more in those months than on the previous 9 months training.... also eating shit loads of food has helped too.....

Cheers guys

[liljunior]

Hey, just found this now...

I hope your more than 80kgs now...sounds like your puttin in the hard yards...

There are things that were said like do your legs that were just said with no real explanation, I hope you understood why to do them...

Remember if your going for strength/size not to do too many reps/sets....otherwise you might as well be doing a pump class (i think thats what the chicks call it)
Eat. At most every 3.5hrs....but the right food. not shit...

One of my mates is friends with Nick Jones from Ozzie land....he supplies this on his website...

Meal # 1
(7.30am) 5 egg whites + 1 whole egg or
200g low fat cottage cheese
1 serve rolled oats or wholemeal toast (2 pieces)

Meal # 2
(10.00am) 2 scoops Macro Whey
1 scoop Pure Carbs and apple
(mix in 300ml water)

Meal # 3
12.00pm 1 serve chicken, fish(tuna) or lean beef
1 serve rice, potato or pasta
1 serve vegetable or salad

Meal # 4
(3.00pm) Same as # 3 (but vary)
Pre Training
(5.00pm)

10ml x Ultimate Male Fuel
3 tspn PUMP TCM Fuel
2 tspn SWELL NAG Fuel
(or mix Fuels in water bottle and consume during extended training sessions)

Meal #5
(immediate after training) - 3 x scoops Macro Whey + 3 scoops Pure Carbs
(mix in 500ml water)
2 x tspn SWELL NAG Fuel

Meal # 6
(8.30pm) 1 serve chicken, fish or lean beef
1 serve rice, potato or pasta
2 serves vegetables or salad

Meal # 7 2 scoops Macro Whey }
200g Nestle diet yogurt } Blend in 300ml water


NOTES:
Consume 42ml water / kg bodyweight / day
Vary exercises, rep range, rep tempo and set volume every 4 weeks
Consume as much variety as possible of proteins, carbs (incl starches, fruit and veg)
Serving Sizes: Protein: Size of hand (palm only)
Carbs: Size of hand (clenched fist) cooked.
OR

2 ½ - 3 g protein / kg bodyweight /day
4-5 g carbs / kg bodyweight / day depending on metabolism
E.F.A’s and extra vitamin B and C may also be beneficial

http://www.gen-tec.com.au/

Obviously you need to see if that suits you....
Buuuut thats basicaly what I did to get to 110kgs (including a cycle) but if you think of your body like an old steam train, the more you put in...the more you get out..... (I think thats also from a TV ad)